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PostPosted: Fri Aug 11, 2006 8:00 am 
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Thanks, Alert. I think we're on the same page, for sure.

However, just to clear up a few things:
1. Clamdiggrr is saying it IS Hard to fake a log.
She may not have read what all has gone down on ARS. FYI:
I know that's not true, as Twisty F*** did fake a supposed
log about me, which was filled with lies. (Although we did find
out someone had gone on IRC, pretending to be me, which was
how they bought it)

2. However, although I cannot say whether this log is factual or not---
I do know some of the facts of Zinji's deal...and it did occur,
it was bad, and seriously NOT Ok, in any way.
This occurred I believe over 10 years ago, for
people not familiar with it. I still say, if the guy isn't here..which
he isn't............it's not a topic that should be hashed out, without
he even being here.

We all know that kind of thing is horrible, and I
can list MANY ABSOLUTELY SICK, DISGUSTING SEXUAL THINGS that
Scientologists have done, if you want to go there...some Sea Org,
some Top Executives. I won't, as I still say that's not why I'm here.
For starters, *If* anyone would like to hear some, check out www.xenutv.com and listen to Astra
Woodcraft, who knew kids raped while "in"...and thankfully is out, now.

3. Yes! RFW is nothing but a pathetic page written by sick people
pretending to themselves and others to have 'higher powers"
when they REFUSE to talk to any of us they've written TONS of lies
about. If that's "OT">..............You can HAVE IT!!! :P :anykey:

That's all.........nite. :zzz:

Tory/Magoo~~ 8)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Aug 11, 2006 2:50 pm 
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clamdigrr wrote:
Because a chat log is so hard to fake...

Session Start: Fri Juvember 32 25:45:96 2006
<Elvis> So did you get that chicken and waffles order for me, Janice?
<The Pearl> You know, god - just shut up.
<Elvis> Don't be cruel, Ms. Joplin. Get it, be cruel?
<The Pearl> Yes. I got it, man. Now, shut up!
<Elvis> I could go for a fried bologna sandwich right now.
<The Pearl> This is why I drink, you know. These conversations...



I have never ever jumped on Zinj for that. Ever. Even when people who weren't on the channel that day were doing so. But I will say this, I know people who were on the channel and read the referred to commentary.


Last edited by Ball of Fluff on Fri Aug 11, 2006 2:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 11, 2006 2:52 pm 
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[quote="magoo1"]Thanks, Alert. I think we're on the same page, for sure.

However, just to clear up a few things:
1. Clamdiggrr is saying it IS Hard to fake a log.
She may not have read what all has gone down on ARS. FYI:
I know that's not true, as Twisty F*** did fake a supposed
log about me, which was filled with lies. (Although we did find
out someone had gone on IRC, pretending to be me, which was
how they bought it)

[quote]

Actually, I think C'digger is being sarcastic/ironic and is saying it is easy to fake one.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Aug 11, 2006 3:12 pm 
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Ball of Fluff wrote:
RIPODB, The problematic aspect is only in that you snipped the rest of what I did say. I said far more than just "so what".


I thought I was doing you a favor by snipping the rest of your post as it was a rather lame justification for assassinating Mark's character. Just because "there are many people here and elsewhere who are wrong about things yet are sure about them" is no excuse for dragging Mark's name through the mud. That's a classic flufferization. Mark's done more for the cause than you and your buddies combined. Sour grapes anyone?

I'd like to personally thank all the buttersquashers for contributing to this thread. It really cleared a lot of things up for me. Do you really wonder why Bob decided he'd had enough? Could it be that he was prepared to deal with Co$, but had no idea he'd also have to deal with "critics" sniping at him at the same time? You all should be really ashamed. Down with buttersquash!


Last edited by RIPODB on Fri Aug 11, 2006 3:43 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Logs about Zinjifar
PostPosted: Fri Aug 11, 2006 3:17 pm 
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SuzanneMarie wrote:
Butwehave11 wrote about Zinj (Joe Lynn):

"Who would have the logs, if someone did have them?"

The answer is on RFW, and the link is here:

http://www.parishioners.org/extremists/lynnlogs.html


I love how "critics" are using shit that's webbed on RFW to defame Zinj when he doesn't even post here. Would you also like to take a shot at Proflex while you're at it? He has crimes too, you know. Oh yeah, Proflex wasn't the one who exposed your BS. Maybe ya'll could call the Cleveland Street Association and warn them about Zinj. You might want to let them know that I rape babies while you're at it. You can take some people out of the cult, but you obviously can't take the cult out of some people.


Last edited by RIPODB on Fri Aug 11, 2006 3:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Aug 11, 2006 3:40 pm 
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Exactly...........

Ball of Fluff: Good for you for "never jumping in"...but I think you just did, didn't you? This, to me, is stirring up a pot that 2 of us have now said (well, 1 by the time you posted this) said---if he isn't here, don't keep bring it up. You said:

Quote:
But I will say this, I know people who were on the channel and read the referred to commentary.


That's still bringing it up, whether you know it, or not. I already said I know it's true....................AND I said I know Scientologists who have done some of THE grossest Sexual things I'd ever heard of (and I was a pretty wild kid, but this stuff was beyondo).......so let's expose the CULT
and leave the rest, ok?

Happy Friday to one, and ALL :wink:

Tory/Magoo~~ 8)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Aug 11, 2006 3:43 pm 
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I was being utterly sarcastic Tory.

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Walk out the door,
Just turn around now,
'Cause you're not welcome anymore...


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Aug 11, 2006 6:34 pm 
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magoo1 wrote:
Exactly...........

Ball of Fluff: Good for you for "never jumping in"...but I think you just did, didn't you? This, to me, is stirring up a pot that 2 of us have now said (well, 1 by the time you posted this) said---if he isn't here, don't keep bring it up. You said:

Quote:
But I will say this, I know people who were on the channel and read the referred to commentary.


That's still bringing it up, whether you know it, or not. I already said I know it's true....................AND I said I know Scientologists who have done some of THE grossest Sexual things I'd ever heard of (and I was a pretty wild kid, but this stuff was beyondo).......so let's expose the CULT
and leave the rest, ok?

Happy Friday to one, and ALL :wink:

Tory/Magoo~~ 8)


Hi, Tory,

I said that I never gave Zinj a bad time about it.

My comment here was about the logs and that I know people who'd read them.

As to exposing the cult and leaving the rest, you might want to take that up with the people who are shrieking about Buttersquashers.

At least we've now proven that I exist-LOL.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Aug 11, 2006 6:38 pm 
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RIPODB wrote:
Ball of Fluff wrote:
RIPODB, The problematic aspect is only in that you snipped the rest of what I did say. I said far more than just "so what".


I thought I was doing you a favor by snipping the rest of your post as it was a rather lame justification for assassinating Mark's character. Just because "there are many people here and elsewhere who are wrong about things yet are sure about them" is no excuse for dragging Mark's name through the mud. That's a classic flufferization. Mark's done more for the cause than you and your buddies combined. Sour grapes anyone?

I'd like to personally thank all the buttersquashers for contributing to this thread. It really cleared a lot of things up for me. Do you really wonder why Bob decided he'd had enough? Could it be that he was prepared to deal with Co$, but had no idea he'd also have to deal with "critics" sniping at him at the same time? You all should be really ashamed. Down with buttersquash!


I said that people make mistakes.

Which means that people can be wrong about things.

I've seen so much of this sort of thing in the past 8 years and I myself have garnered more of it than most.

It sucks, of course, but it's something people will always do.

Also, I was around on a.r.s. when Bob Minton was still involved with the LMT and also before it was established. He was regarded as a god, just about. The "sniping" to which you refer happened after the LMT was closed and after he left th critic's scene. Not before.

And, as I said, a number of people at that party (see Patty's write up) are people who've never been linked with the oh so dreaded buttersquashers.

Like Dave T, Chuck B, Patty P...

And, no, I have nothing of which to be ashamed. More than I can say about you and a few others here.

If you've issues with things Henri, Kady or whomever else have said, then they're not difficult people to find on the 'net. I'm sure they're just dying to hear from you.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Aug 11, 2006 7:16 pm 
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Clamdigrr: DOH!!!!

B of Fluff....True, you're now "Official" :wink: :!:

As far as:
Quote:
As to exposing the cult and leaving the rest, you might want to take that up with the people who are shrieking about Buttersquashers.


I believe I have made this statement......way earlier than this,
saying: ENOUGH!

Did you miss it?

And by the way, I don't run, own, have ANY control over anyone,
any more than you do....so all I can do is say, enough of the distraction:
EXPOSE THE CULT AND THEIR ABUSES, and please remember the people coming on here, hoping to find ANSWERS.

Happy Friday :wink:

Tory/Magoo~~ 8)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Aug 11, 2006 7:33 pm 
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BOF wrote:
Quote:
And, no, I have nothing of which to be ashamed. More than I can say about you and a few others here.


Never defend. Always attack, attack, attack! You learned well from your master.

I've done plenty of things in my life and some things on this board that I'm ashamed of and eventually experienced personal growth after I realized the error of my ways.

I know feeling shame is way too low on the tone scale for a Hubbardite like yourself so I shouldn't have expected for you to ever feel shame. I apologize for expecting something from you that you clearly cannot do. Please just go back to playing your game, which assures you that you'll never have to experience pesky human emotions like shame.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Aug 11, 2006 8:19 pm 
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xenutv wrote:
There are many among the squashers I admire but I don't think they deserve unabashed praise. Many times they come to their conclusions and then set out to convince others with no facts to back them up. They are damned sure about something yet can be completely wrong.


Well, yes. To me they sometimes seem trapped in their own subset of scientology criticism, a 'not invented here' attitude that doesn't accept that anyone else is worth communicating with. They assume all critics are on IRC (no UK critics are IIRC) for example.

Do I care? Not a lot. They are welcome to pursue their lines of attack, as we do ours. This is one of the downsides to being in anarchy - no leaders, no organisations, nothing the cult can stamp out.

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Still looking for 9,950,000 scientologists.
http://news-from-bree.blogspot.com/
http://www.newsfrombree.co.uk/


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Aug 11, 2006 8:21 pm 
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Patty started this thread in good faith to just acknowledge a few critics that made a difference. Well,here is another one.
Many of us have been involved as activists-some long ago.

Leonard Fusselman was the first critic I met. 1977-78?

We all met together in Los Angeles. He had a heart of gold. Freezoners and critic types all met together at his home. I repost this about once per year hoping to locate someone else who knew him.

The guy was a gentle soul. One of those really old timers that knew Hubbard in the day..yadda yadda yadda.
I seriously doubt he would have taken the risks he did-in effect used his home as a clubhouse of sorts with this sort of infighting.

Because this was late 70's-the only material we had was Robert Kaufman's book INSIDE SCIENTOLOGY. The first critical book on SCN. He was a close friend of Paulette Coopers.

Repost:

http://ocmb.xenu.net/ocmb/viewtopic.php ... 14aca41bd7


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Aug 11, 2006 9:21 pm 
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pitbull wrote:
Yes, like many people, there was a time when I thought there was some
very good things about the LMT.


for example?.....



pitbull?.......


attention to 'profit' of lmt members is one of the BIGGEST cult projections of its own behavior.. especially when lisa mc pherson worked at amc and the money went up up and away....

citation
http://www.bizjournals.com/tampabay/sto ... allb1.html
citation
http://www.lermanet.com/cisar/russia/971205a.htm
citation
http://www.bizjournals.com/tampabay/sto ... tory5.html
citation
http://www.bizjournals.com/tampabay/sto ... ily10.html
citation
www.lermanet.com/scientologynews/allstate.html


The three owners of Agent Media Corp. Inc. in Clearwater have more than determination. The company was founded in Texas in 1988.

One (Allstate) member suggested at a monthly meeting in early 1988 that the group consider hiring outside consultants to help in the effort. But they say Ms. O'Hara didn't point out that she knew the trainer, Donald Pearson, through a Scientology communications class she had taken.

Between 1988 and 1992, it turns out, the Good Hands company entrusted the training of workers coast to coast to a consultant teaching Scientology management principles. (Note: But last October, *1994* an incident in Florida showed that speculation among Allstate agents about the influence of Scientology on the company is far from dead.

For more than two months in late 1988 and 1989, about 50 managers and agents in the region spent two to three days each week in classes at Mr. Pearson's Sacramento office, which was decorated with Mr. Hubbard's vivid paintings of spaceships and moonscapes.

"In 1989, it was becoming apparent that I had a desirable product, and it actually was becoming easy to do business," said Schaffner.

"He snuck in about a half-hour on the promotional literature," says John Softye, a New York agent who took Mr. Pearson's Agent Prosperity Seminar in 1989.

In Arizona, for example, workers say they noticed a disturbing change in a key supervisor's management style after their Hubbard training in July 1990.

During 1991, the year after her bankruptcy, Lisa McPherson donated 11,828 dollars to the Dallas branch of Scientology.

In 1992, without acknowledging any past problems, the company scaled back its reliance on Mr. Hubbard's teachings. By 1993, Mr. Pearson had stopped giving any seminars at the company. But fear of Scientology persisted at Allstate, and the brief Scientology discussion at Sears's 1993 annual meeting did little to ease agents' concerns about the Scientology link.

That fall, for example, some agents participating in a new training program, the Agency Development Process, noticed two pages, titled "Statistics Graphs, How to Figure the Scale," that were identical to those found in the Scientology material.

The company made the move to Clearwater in 1994 and purchased a small warehouse to set up shop.

In 1994, the AMC Publishing company, where Lisa worked, transferred from Dallas to Clearwater. The company owners - also Scientologists - wanted to be nearer to the spiritual center of the "church," which is known as the "Flag Organization," or simply "Flag."

At the time, Lisa's expenditures for for services at "Flag" had risen considerably. According to her records for 1994, the "church" presented her with a bill for auditing in the amount of 75,275 dollars. From the same document, Lisa paid 54,667 dollars as partial payment of her debt.


In May 1994, New York agent Mr. Softye, who describes himself as a devout Catholic, refused to take a test that preceded participation in the (Allstate) Agency Development Process, which he believed was related to Scientology training. He initially received a "job- in-jeopardy" reprimand, though it was rescinded when he complained to corporate headquarters that the test conflicted with his religious values.

But last October, (1994) an incident in Florida showed that speculation among Allstate agents about the influence of Scientology on the company is far from dead.

In January 1995, Lisa gave Scientology 3,000 dollars.

In February 1995, the sum came to over 6,500 dollars.

In March 1995, more than 10,000 dollars.

In June 1995, nearly 9,000 dollars.

In August 1995, over 11,000 dollars.

And this was in spite of the fact that "AMC Publishing" paid her 8.475 dollars in March, 8, 800 in June and 5,400 in August.


The group has exceeded gross revenues of more than $1 million since 1995

Besides that, according to records, she put lesser sums into special joint accounts with which her employer supported the "church." Scientology covered its debt by transferring the money from Lisa McPherson's account to an account where it could be withdrawn.

In February, Lisa McPherson put 13,000 dollars on account for auditing on the basic level of Scientology, where she still was after 13 years in the "church." In April, 12,450 dollars were removed from her account for auditing, spent for one large amount of auditing. In the course of 1995, she spent 18,620 dollars on services, which prepared her for crossing into the highest level of Scientology.

On December 5, 1995, Lisa McPherson was dead on arrival at a hospital 45 minutes north of Clearwater Florida. According to the coroner's report, Lisa was underweight, severely dehydrated, and had bruises and bug bites (see the entire report here).

http://www.lisamcpherson.org/

Agent Media reported $6.8 million in revenue in 2002 and employs about 20.

Agent Media Corp. in Clearwater, a database and marketing company for the life, health and annuity segments of the insurance industry, was sold to Post Capital Partners LLC, a New York-based private investment firm, and Roscoe C. Smith III, a publishing industry veteran. Terms of the transaction were not disclosed. Agent Media's marquee publications include the Agent's Sales Journal, a tabloid-sized publication with a circulation of 360,000 independent insurance agents; the Agent's Market Pack, a direct mail card pack; and Insurance Marketing magazine, developed exclusively for insurance wholesalers and home office marketing executives. Agent Media's marquee publications include the Agent's Sales Journal, a tabloid-sized publication with a circulation of 360,000 independent insurance agents; the Agent's Market Pack, a direct mail card pack; and Insurance Marketing magazine, developed exclusively for insurance wholesalers and home office marketing executives.



Jax wrote:
From 1995 on, the entire sequence of events seems suspicious.
In May & June of 1995 Lisa had her first "psychotic break".
I believe that this "break" was a result of her having discovered something very disturbing & true about her church (it rocked her world) & the church didn't want it exposed.
I think thats where investigation should be focused.
What happened right around that time?
What did Lisa find out?
What did she know?

follow the money... where did it go?


http://www.rickross.com/reference/scien ... en173.html

Scientologists, critics sharing woman's name
St. Petersburg Times, December 20, 1999
By Thomas C. Tobin

CLEARWATER -- Vowing to speak out against "the propaganda of hate," a new
organization of local Scientologists is gearing up to counter the efforts
of Robert S. Minton, the New England millionaire who is setting up shop in
downtown Clearwater to oppose the Church of Scientology. The new
organization is called the Lisa McPherson Foundation, named for the veteran
Scientologist whose 1995 death while in the care of church members has
saddled Scientology with a lawsuit, a criminal prosecution and increased
pressure from its critics.

And, in an added twist that local Scientologists find appalling, the case
has resulted in McPherson's name being used against the church they say she
loved.
Although McPherson had been a practicing Scientologist for 13 years, the
church's critics consider her a martyr for their cause. The name of
Minton's group, for example, is the Lisa McPherson Trust, which plans to
present a dark picture of Scientology to locals and provide "exit
counseling" for those who want to leave the church. In contrast, the Lisa
McPherson Foundation seeks to pull McPherson's name back into the
Scientology camp by opposing Minton at every turn and by "standing up for
religious tolerance," said Bennetta Slaughter, the foundation's leader.

Slaughter, a prominent Scientologist in Clearwater, was McPherson's
longtime friend and employer at AMC Publishing Co.

"I will, in fact, counter any hate that will come from them and I will
handle that," Slaughter said of Minton and his group in an interview last
week. "They are not going to poison this town." She added: "There's a large
difference between free speech and the propaganda of hate. . . . Name one
good thing that he's bringing to this community. I can't think of one."

The foundation has about 300 members, Slaughter said.
Its first project was an inch-thick binder using information compiled by
Church of Scientology staff members. The binder documents Minton's
controversial encounters with the church, two of which have resulted in his
arrest on misdemeanor battery charges.

It also includes background information on five Scientology critics who
have worked with Minton, including records on criminal convictions,
criminal allegations and instances when Scientology has defeated them in
civil courts.
Slaughter said the foundation doesn't plan to widely disseminate the binder
but will "give it to people who are in positions who should know . . . so
that they can be informed."

She added the group would oppose Minton in other ways as needed. The
foundation also will be working with other local churches on "social
betterment activities" and will promote the "restoration of religious
practice" in all denominations as a way to reduce social ills, Slaughter
said.

"It matters not to me where people go to church," she said. "I'd just like
to see them go to church."

She said most Scientologists in Clearwater are longtime members who resent
an outsider like Minton telling them their church abuses people. In a phone
interview from his New Hampshire farm, Minton responded, saying he
primarily is opposed to Scientology's strict "ethics" system, which he
called harmful.

He cited records that came to light after McPherson's death indicating she
was struggling under a Scientology ethics program being administered at
Slaughter's company. In a wrongful death lawsuit filed by McPherson's
family and financed by Minton, that ethics program is alleged to have
caused the severe mental breakdown that played a key role in her death.
"Bennetta Slaughter is herself part and parcel of the Scientology abuse
process," Minton said.

He said he plans to close his purchase of a local headquarters on Jan. 5.
He has said the building is next to a Scientology property in downtown
Clearwater, but has not named the location. The staff will include former
Scientologists who want to share their perceptions of the church with
current members.

Echoing Scientology officials, Slaughter characterized Minton's
headquarters as a deprograming center that will illegally detain people.
She called it "the height of arrogance" for Minton to be interpreting
Scientology for Scientologists.
"I find that so offensive, as do every single one of my friends in the
church," she said. "He's trying to position himself as someone reasonable,
when in fact what he's saying is complete bunk."

_________________
Lisa McPherson escaped long enough to show she had heart...before scientology killed her
Image


Last edited by lrh_lied on Fri Aug 11, 2006 9:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: The Buttersquash Conspiracy
PostPosted: Fri Aug 11, 2006 9:21 pm 
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RIPODB wrote:

"You might want to let them know I rape babies while you're at it."

Dude, I thought that was supposed to be a secret! Also, I thought this thread was supposed to be about the Buttersquash Conspiracy, not you and your lamentable habits, not me and why I'm here, not Proflex or any of the other irrelevancies you and others are bringing in to derail the thread.

The topic is the Buttersquash Conspiracy. Joe Lynn/Zinj, his character and credibility, are being discussed here because he is a major detractor of the Buttersquashers. He gave them their nickname. If you don't know anything about what happened and think those who do know are full of it, of course you can post here. No one can stop you. But why bother?

PS-- I am not a Scientology critic. Especially not a Scientology 'critic'.


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