Who's responsible for what David Miscavige has done?

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Semioldguard
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Who's responsible for what David Miscavige has done?

Post by Semioldguard » Wed Mar 16, 2016 8:03 am

Is it:

1. David Miscavige

2. Those who allowed David Miscavige to get into power and into a position to be able to do what he's done.

3. Both #1 and #2.

Don Carlo
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Re: Who's responsible for what David Miscavige has done?

Post by Don Carlo » Wed Mar 16, 2016 2:05 pm

Be sure to include Hubbard and especially the lawyer-whores.

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'Alert'
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Re: Who's responsible for what David Miscavige has done?

Post by 'Alert' » Thu Mar 17, 2016 5:59 am

Again, easy.
In my country we have what is called "chain of command"
So in essence, Hubbard will always be ultimately responsible. DM is nothing more than a puppet of Hubbard's creation
"If anyone talks about a "road to Freedom" he is talking about a linear line. This, then, must have boundaries. If there are boundaries there is no freedom." - Dianetics 55

Semioldguard
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Re: Who's responsible for what David Miscavige has done?

Post by Semioldguard » Thu Mar 17, 2016 1:41 pm

'Alert' wrote:Again, easy.
In my country we have what is called "chain of command"
So in essence, Hubbard will always be ultimately responsible. DM is nothing more than a puppet of Hubbard's creation
Wasn't it Hubbard's intention that someone else other than David Miscavige take over the church of scientology from him?

Don Carlo
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Re: Who's responsible for what David Miscavige has done?

Post by Don Carlo » Thu Mar 17, 2016 9:27 pm

Hubbard focused on his own power, wealth and safety-from-the-law in his own lifetime. His main gesture toward his wife and children was an earlier will that was kept and ripped-apart by somebody-else, with the key who-gets-what page missing. That will was replaced by the thumbprint will; see J. Swift link below.

Since the aged Hubbard was desperately auditing himself, he probably was in denial about his poor health. He couldn't officially appoint a successor, anyway, since the fiction was that he was not running CoS, and he couldn't appear in public to make even an unofficial announcement, since he was hiding from Federal law enforcement.

His final last days, incapacitated by a stroke, make any designation of a successor impossible, and the thumbprint will is debunked in J. Swift's interesting thread, viewtopic.php?f=9&t=30969

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Wieber
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Re: Who's responsible for what David Miscavige has done?

Post by Wieber » Fri Mar 18, 2016 1:48 am

There are at least two kinds of cult leaders. There may be more. One founds the organization they lead. The other takes over an organization and either makes it into a cult or keeps running it as a cult on their own terms. David Miscavige appears to be another cult leader, per chapter five of Captive Hearts Captive Minds. Within the limitations imposed on him by Hubbard he seems to be doing just fine running Scientology for his own personal benefit.
“Think wrongly if you please, but in all cases think for yourself.”
Doris Lessing

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'Alert'
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Re: Who's responsible for what David Miscavige has done?

Post by 'Alert' » Fri Mar 18, 2016 3:08 am

Semioldguard wrote:
'Alert' wrote:Again, easy.
In my country we have what is called "chain of command"
So in essence, Hubbard will always be ultimately responsible. DM is nothing more than a puppet of Hubbard's creation
Wasn't it Hubbard's intention that someone else other than David Miscavige take over the church of scientology from him?
Its irrelevant that the Broeker's were ostensibly positioned to take it up after that turd Hubbard died.
Hubbard's sole intention IMHO was, to create a race of uber mensch (homo Novis)not unlike Hitler in the pursuit to rule the world.
"If anyone talks about a "road to Freedom" he is talking about a linear line. This, then, must have boundaries. If there are boundaries there is no freedom." - Dianetics 55

Semioldguard
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Re: Who's responsible for what David Miscavige has done?

Post by Semioldguard » Fri Mar 18, 2016 3:01 pm

'Alert' wrote:Its irrelevant that the Broeker's were ostensibly positioned to take it up after that turd Hubbard died.
How is it irrelevant when trying to assess Hubbard's level of responsibility in what David Miscavige has done with the position of power he has attained in the church of scientology by presenting the fact that Hubbard intended someone other than David Miscavige to take power in the church of scientology?

Don Carlo
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Re: Who's responsible for what David Miscavige has done?

Post by Don Carlo » Fri Mar 18, 2016 7:35 pm

Probably if his children were allowed to visit Hubbard and they pressed him to name a successor, Hubbard might have named his daughter, Diana, who could be arrogant and ruthless. Anyone else who was power-hungry enough to grab power while Hubbard had a stroke and died, would have been corrupted by the near-absolute power in CoS. The slightest mistake of the "new boss" might have left him / her vulnerable to a palace coup by Miscavige.

You may enjoy mooning over what-might-have-been but the Hubbard-true-successor topic was a chew toy for years on alt-religion-scientology, ex-Scientology Message Board, and this board. It's been discussed already.

Semioldguard
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Re: Who's responsible for what David Miscavige has done?

Post by Semioldguard » Fri Mar 18, 2016 8:12 pm

Don Carlo wrote:You may enjoy mooning over what-might-have-been but the Hubbard-true-successor topic was a chew toy for years on alt-religion-scientology, ex-Scientology Message Board, and this board. It's been discussed already.
I'm aware that that subject matter has been discussed before.

Is "Hubbard-true-successor" the subject matter of this thread?

The reason why I was elaborating on it was because you brought up Hubbard in response to the subject matter of this thread.

If one is gauging Hubbard's level of responsibility in what David Miscavige has done, how can the subject of who Hubbard intended to be his successor be left out?

Don Carlo
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Re: Who's responsible for what David Miscavige has done?

Post by Don Carlo » Sat Mar 19, 2016 3:29 pm

I speculated. How about you speculate?

Semioldguard
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Re: Who's responsible for what David Miscavige has done?

Post by Semioldguard » Sat Mar 19, 2016 8:06 pm

Don Carlo wrote:I speculated. How about you speculate?
I'd rather not, for two reasons:

1. I prefer to deal in facts and truth rather than speculation.

2. I didn't put up the thread for the purpose of posting my speculation.

I guess a better question would have been:

David Miscavige and Hubbard aside, who else assisted David Miscavige to get into a position of power in the church of scientology to be able to do what he's done?

Don Carlo
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Re: Who's responsible for what David Miscavige has done?

Post by Don Carlo » Sun Mar 20, 2016 3:01 pm

Who helped Miscavige? Bullied and scared fellow workers.

Oh, you don't speculate? You presented "the fact that Hubbard intended someone other than David Miscavige to take power in the church of scientology?" How do YOU know this "fact," when you can't name this "someone other"?

Semioldguard
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Re: Who's responsible for what David Miscavige has done?

Post by Semioldguard » Sun Mar 20, 2016 8:12 pm

Don Carlo wrote:Who helped Miscavige? Bullied and scared fellow workers.

Oh, you don't speculate? You presented "the fact that Hubbard intended someone other than David Miscavige to take power in the church of scientology?" How do YOU know this "fact," when you can't name this "someone other"?
It's been common knowledge all over the Internet for years that Hubbard intended someone other than David Miscavige to take over the church of scientology.

I guess it depends on how things have to be before one considers something to be a fact.

Do you know for a fact that Hubbard intended that David Miscavige take over the church of scientology?

Don Carlo
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Re: Who's responsible for what David Miscavige has done?

Post by Don Carlo » Mon Mar 21, 2016 3:03 pm

The present regulars on this website have no special knowledge of Hubbard's intentions, if any, for a successor. We're a blabby lot and we'd have REPORTED it. You're demanding revelations out of us, that we can't deliver. Ex-Scientologist Message Board has more ex-execs who could speculate better than us, if you ask nicely.

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