And another Org closed: Greensboro, NC.

A place to post and debate the Church of Scientology.
Post Reply
User avatar
Peter Schilte
Posts: 1864
Joined: Mon May 15, 2006 7:22 pm
Location: Vierlingsbeek (Netherlands)

And another Org closed: Greensboro, NC.

Post by Peter Schilte » Mon Aug 17, 2009 4:22 pm

Yes folks, the show is over! Greensboro has been cleared!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_llrdhL2 ... annel_page

Peter
"THE ONLY WAY YOU CAN CONTROL PEOPLE IS TO LIE TO THEM."
- L. Ron Hubbard

http://www.scamofscientology.nl

User avatar
Wieber
Posts: 10238
Joined: Tue May 23, 2006 10:57 pm

Post by Wieber » Mon Aug 17, 2009 8:33 pm

I was at a do where Jane Kember (remember her - she was THE Guardian of scientology) appeared in person and gave a talk. She said that for scientology having to close an "org" was an extreme "engram." She said that scientology just does not allow "orgs" to close.

Even though she's gone from the hierarchy and in disgrace from the Miscavige regime, I'm sure what she said still holds true in scientology now. For scientology closing the Greensboro "org" was a major loss. You can be sure of that.
“Think wrongly if you please, but in all cases think for yourself.”
Doris Lessing

Image

User avatar
GreatSunJester
Posts: 240
Joined: Tue Aug 23, 2005 5:48 pm

Post by GreatSunJester » Mon Aug 17, 2009 8:37 pm

So... do the force what few locals left to move to a new home, or just cut them loose into mental freedom?
In Search of... a new sig!

User avatar
Wieber
Posts: 10238
Joined: Tue May 23, 2006 10:57 pm

Post by Wieber » Mon Aug 17, 2009 10:50 pm

GreatSunJester wrote:So... do the force what few locals left to move to a new home, or just cut them loose into mental freedom?
That's a good question. I'd like to know the answer to it, too.

I would think if any staff member were with the sea organization they would be recalled and reassigned. It's very common for regular "orgs" to have sea organization members working in them.

I am guessing the non sea organization staff members would have the option of relocating to another "org" or being saddled with a "free loader debt."

Props to Greensboro Anonymous but they should be alert to any other form of scientology remaining in the area, such as a group of some kind or other start up entity.
“Think wrongly if you please, but in all cases think for yourself.”
Doris Lessing

Image

User avatar
hartley
Posts: 1124
Joined: Tue Jan 20, 2004 5:07 pm
Location: Bucks, UK
Contact:

Post by hartley » Mon Aug 17, 2009 10:57 pm

It would indeed seem that the lease ran out on the North Carolina Org. A leaked Email posted on ESMB:
Hello!!

Well, we have had a busy couple of months recently. I apologize for not being in communication earlier but we needed to be more certain of our plans. We are now in a transition in terms of our delivery here.

What we have decided to do is now based on the most recent release of LRH's materials which updates and expands on the delivery of Dianetics!! It is actually quite exdciting and will address what the majority of us got into Dianetics and Scientology to address. If you don't yet have the new Dianetics releases, please contact me or Pam Bryant so we can get you the materials. AMAZING!!!!

Additionally, we are coming close to the end of our lease in our present location so we are moving our materials to a secure location for now. We will begin to deliver Dianetics seminars. Pam Bryant will be getting trained to do the delivery of the new Dianetics Seminars and courses.. No dates confirmed as yet, but stay alert and expect to hear from us. We will be in touch so you know where to come or send anyone who is interested.


Selena Henderson
Pam Bryant
No premises and no date for reopening, no mass, it's closed. I take the above to indicate that the Org no longer exists and that its former staff will be running a Dianetics Center.

In the old days the Sea Org would have been in there making things go right.
ARSCC Demographics Department
Still looking for 9,950,000 scientologists.
http://news-from-bree.blogspot.com/
http://www.newsfrombree.co.uk/

User avatar
Dorothy
Posts: 1957
Joined: Tue Feb 05, 2008 9:03 pm
Location: Kansas

Post by Dorothy » Wed Aug 19, 2009 4:26 am

Please forgive me if my response to this thread sounds SuzanneMarie-ish, but I am pretty sure that Greensboro, is not and never was an "Org" as in Class V scientology "church". It was actually what is called a "city office", which can be big but usually a city office is much smaller than a mission. A city office is like a little satellite org of a bigger org, hence the name "city office". I'm not sure which org was the "mother" org of this city office, could be Atlanta or Miami or one of the beltway orgs. I met a woman once at Flag, and her name was Lynn Peters, an OT 8. She told me all about the Greensboro city office. She lived there and had something to do with establishing it. It had maybe 4 or 5 staff. When I was on staff I saw many city offices fold up. As mentioned earlier in this thread, orgs and missions never really close because it is considered too much of a huge flap up at Int. So what happens is, if an Org is not doing well, it just shrinks down. An Org can go from 100 staff to 5 staff and it never gets "demoted" to a mission, it just remains a tiny org, and no, they would never let an Org close. They would send Sea Org members to man it and re-establish it. Also the "mother" org that sponsors the city office gets to count their stats. So, if a city office has hardly any stats and it closes, the org hardly notices it and it does not affect any stats at Int level (slappy's stats) so it would hardly be noticed. A good sized org can make the stats of a small city office in a day or even half a day.

Don't get me wrong, its still a "win". Its just not the magnitude of win as maybe you thought.

I wonder what happened to Lynn Peters. She seemed like a really nice lady. She played in the local symphony but I forget what instrument. Maybe the cello.
“The sad truth is that most evil is done by people who never make up their minds to be good or evil.”
― Hannah Arendt

User avatar
hartley
Posts: 1124
Joined: Tue Jan 20, 2004 5:07 pm
Location: Bucks, UK
Contact:

Post by hartley » Wed Aug 19, 2009 5:24 am

Dorothy wrote:Please forgive me if my response to this thread sounds SuzanneMarie-ish, but I am pretty sure that Greensboro, is not and never was an "Org" as in Class V scientology "church".
It is in the CoS Internet Global Locator as a 'Church'. Missions are labelled 'Missions'. I can't think offhand of any 'Churches' that are not Class V.
It was actually what is called a "city office", which can be big but usually a city office is much smaller than a mission.
That's a new concept to me. <sigh> Have I just discovered another layer of the onion that I didn't know about? Can you point to any other Churches on the Global Locator that are not Class V? Can you point to any 'city offices' on the Locator?
I'm quite concerned here as if the the CoS is disguising small offices as 'churches' then that throws my stats out! :-)
I'm not sure which org was the "mother" org of this city office, could be Atlanta or Miami or one of the beltway orgs.
Washington DC.
ARSCC Demographics Department
Still looking for 9,950,000 scientologists.
http://news-from-bree.blogspot.com/
http://www.newsfrombree.co.uk/

P. Don Ron
Posts: 132
Joined: Fri Jul 27, 2007 3:26 am

Post by P. Don Ron » Wed Aug 19, 2009 8:16 am

hartley wrote:That's a new concept to me. <sigh> Have I just discovered another layer of the onion that I didn't know about? Can you point to any other Churches on the Global Locator that are not Class V? Can you point to any 'city offices' on the Locator
I wasn't aware that City Offices still existed, but here is a link to a current City Office.

Church of Scientology City Office of Pittsburgh


Definition from Admin Dictionary - its not a Class V Org
CITY OFFICE, 1. has less than 35 staff
members, has a Six Section System and org
board. It gives training and processing as
assigned by WW and its continental senior.
It has Field Staff Members. Its Evening
Foundation has the same type org board as
the Day City Office. (HCO PL 21 Oct 66 II)

2. Class I to III org. (HCO PL 6 Feb 66)

3. any organization having less than ten persons
is classed as a City Office or Formin-a
Org. A City Office is organized to do PE
and select persons to upper 'orgs to do
co-audits and non-classed courses and incidental
processing. A City Office may not
have executive secretaries. It can have an
HCO Area See and an Org See and an org
board such as fits its actual functions. (HCO
PL 30 Jan 66 II)

4. a City Office evolves
much as a large Central Organization did. A
City Office is at its beginning characterized
by the fact that everyone on staff wears all
the hats. There is no individuation of departments.
Later some semi-individuation
can take place. This comes in as income
grows. Even if all the titles are worn, the
departments do not exist in fact and a condition
can arise where people try to be department
heads when they are really just
sweeping floors. In a City Office at first one
cannot afford to employ administrative staff
who only administer. The first break-out of
this is hiring a receptionist. A City Office is
composed almost entirely of technical personnel
who while working at technical activities
(teaching, processing) somehow handle
administration. A City Office invoices
everything received, banks it all and pays all
its salaries and bills by cheque. That is the
lowest rung of an accounts department. Probably
the Assn See in a City Office does
this. The records are kept no further and
someday get audited. The fundamental action
of a City Office is technical service. A
City Office which is well established may
have seven or eight people on staff. A City
Office, well-handled, can grow to become a
Central Organization with a Six Department
System. (HCO PL 21 Feb 61) Abbr. CITO.

User avatar
no_8c_now
Posts: 1179
Joined: Sat Jun 12, 2004 8:04 pm

Post by no_8c_now » Wed Aug 19, 2009 5:47 pm

I recall city offices was the term used before Missions. Maybe something to do with getting religious status?

User avatar
Simonymous
Posts: 1155
Joined: Tue Feb 26, 2008 2:48 am

Post by Simonymous » Wed Aug 19, 2009 7:33 pm

Go Team Greensboro!

Sometimes the Bible Belt comes in handy. They don't take kindly to cults in the Bible Belt, especially in the Carolinas, thanks to PTL with Jim and Tammy Bakker. (An old mate of mine from uni lived there and used to tell us the craziest stories. They easily rivalled Scientology in money-grubbing and lying! But that's for another day.)

So Greensboro's shut, Atlanta lost their Dunwoody lease and Sandy Springs can't happen due to zoning issues. North Carolina had another mission in Charlotte that shut down last year; it was so poorly placed and unused the Anons have to picket downtown instead!

Sandy Springs, GA thread:
viewtopic.php?t=31167

Dunwoody, GA thread:
viewtopic.php?t=31168

Charlotte, NC thread:
viewtopic.php?t=20177

TICK TOCK TICK TOCK!
“...the injuries that {Hubbard} handled by the use of Dianetics procedures were never handled, because they were injuries that never existed; therefore, Dianetics is based on a lie; therefore, Scientology is based on a lie.” --Tommy Davis

User avatar
hartley
Posts: 1124
Joined: Tue Jan 20, 2004 5:07 pm
Location: Bucks, UK
Contact:

Post by hartley » Wed Aug 19, 2009 8:36 pm

I looked that one up on the Global Locator and it's labeled "Church of Scientology City Office of Pittsburgh", same as above. On a quick USA scan I can't see any others, so it appears to be an anomaly.

Since the Global Locator is recent, I'm puzzled that it called Greensboro 'Church of Scientology of North Carolina' if it was indeed run as a City Office.
But then (heh) the Global Locator has yet to remove any of the three North Carolina locations that no longer exist.
ARSCC Demographics Department
Still looking for 9,950,000 scientologists.
http://news-from-bree.blogspot.com/
http://www.newsfrombree.co.uk/

P. Don Ron
Posts: 132
Joined: Fri Jul 27, 2007 3:26 am

Post by P. Don Ron » Thu Aug 20, 2009 2:45 am

no_8c_now wrote:I recall city offices was the term used before Missions. Maybe something to do with getting religious status?
A couple of old HCOPLs, from the 1976 edition Green Vols
HCO POLICY LETTER OF 21 OCTOBER 1966
Issue II

CITY OFFICE SYSTEM

There are several types of Scientology activities and identities as follows.

SEVEN DIVISION ORGANIZATION
SIX DEPARTMENT ORGANIZATION
(see Policy Letter same date)
CITY OFFICE
FRANCHISE CENTRE
PERSONAL EFFICIENCY FOUNDATION
STAFF MEMBER
FIELD STAFF MEMBER
FIELD AUDITOR
BOOK AUDITOR
SCIENTOLOGY GROUPS
MEMBER
SCIENTOLOGIST

The differences are of (1) size (2) Org Board (3) services rendered.

THE SEVEN DIVISION ORGANIZATION has more than 75 staff members, has the
large 1965 org board complete. It gives services as permitted by Worldwide but not less than
Grade IV Training, Grade V Power Processing, a full PE and is also served by a Foundation
(usually on a Six Dept System). It may have one or more executive divisions depending on
whether it is Worldwide, Continental, Zonal, Subzonal or local.

THE SIX DEPARTMENT ORGANIZATION has up to 75 staff members, an org
board similar to the Seven Division Org Board but in Departments. It delivers up to Grade IV
Training and Grade V Power Processing as permitted, operates a PE and may or may not
have a Foundation attached. If so its Foundation is City Office size.

A CITY OFFICE has less than 35 staff members, has a Six Section System and org
board (see Pol Ltr Issue III same date). It gives training and processing as assigned by WW
and its Continental senior. It has Field Staff Members. Its Evening Foundation has the same
type org board as the Day City Office.


A FRANCHISE CENTRE has less than 30 staff members. Its org board simply states
who is there and what he does. It is franchised by official Scientology but is not an "official
org" unless it so requests. It trains all levels up to but not including Level Zero. It can run a
Dianetic Course. It processes up to the classification of the auditor auditing but not including
or above Power Processing. It does not have Power Processing. It concentrates on PE,
individual and coauditing at Dianetic level. It can do group auditing. It operates day or evening
or both.
...

HCO POLICY LETTER OF 1 SEPTEMBER 1965

CURRENT POLICY - FRANCHISE

Stable Franchise Centres are expected to become City Offices, and
other Franchise Holders are expected to build stabilized Centres
toward the end of becoming City Offices. Those not doing so may
become individual Field Staff Members.

FRANCHISE BECOMING CITY OFFICES

Successful Franchise Centres may become City Offices on
application if their record and activity as a Franchise Holder is
adequate.

The requirements of a City Office are (a) corporate regularity by
which is meant their incorporation must be passed up and in
accordance with policy, (b) adequate premises, (c) the presence of
a full time HCO Area Sec. (d) training of someone in org
administration at their Central Org.
...

User avatar
hartley
Posts: 1124
Joined: Tue Jan 20, 2004 5:07 pm
Location: Bucks, UK
Contact:

Post by hartley » Sat Aug 22, 2009 12:06 am

P. Don Ron wrote:(from a 1966 HCOPL)There are several types of Scientology activities and identities as follows.

SEVEN DIVISION ORGANIZATION
SIX DEPARTMENT ORGANIZATION
(see Policy Letter same date)
CITY OFFICE
FRANCHISE CENTRE
PERSONAL EFFICIENCY FOUNDATION
Thanks, that makes it pretty clear what happened. The setup under Miscavige was simpler with just Orgs and Missions and North Carolina was an anomaly by title. It was not however a Mission under SMI jurisdiction.
ARSCC Demographics Department
Still looking for 9,950,000 scientologists.
http://news-from-bree.blogspot.com/
http://www.newsfrombree.co.uk/

User avatar
Simonymous
Posts: 1155
Joined: Tue Feb 26, 2008 2:48 am

Post by Simonymous » Sat Aug 22, 2009 8:29 am

I must admit I'm having a laugh at you guys all arguing missions and orgs... since when does Scientology make a policy or a plan or any way of doing anything, and stick by it? Policy or no, they'll stick whatever on a building just to fit some weird freak-think Miscavige comes up with. So don't sweat the "what's the proper what" LOL! :lol:
“...the injuries that {Hubbard} handled by the use of Dianetics procedures were never handled, because they were injuries that never existed; therefore, Dianetics is based on a lie; therefore, Scientology is based on a lie.” --Tommy Davis

Marcabian Candidate
Posts: 1
Joined: Thu Jan 05, 2017 3:48 pm

Re:

Post by Marcabian Candidate » Thu Jan 05, 2017 4:27 pm

Dorothy wrote:Please forgive me if my response to this thread sounds SuzanneMarie-ish, but I am pretty sure that Greensboro, is not and never was an "Org" as in Class V scientology "church". It was actually what is called a "city office", which can be big but usually a city office is much smaller than a mission. A city office is like a little satellite org of a bigger org, hence the name "city office". I'm not sure which org was the "mother" org of this city office, could be Atlanta or Miami or one of the beltway orgs. I met a woman once at Flag, and her name was Lynn Peters, an OT 8. She told me all about the Greensboro city office. She lived there and had something to do with establishing it. It had maybe 4 or 5 staff. When I was on staff I saw many city offices fold up. As mentioned earlier in this thread, orgs and missions never really close because it is considered too much of a huge flap up at Int. So what happens is, if an Org is not doing well, it just shrinks down. An Org can go from 100 staff to 5 staff and it never gets "demoted" to a mission, it just remains a tiny org, and no, they would never let an Org close. They would send Sea Org members to man it and re-establish it. Also the "mother" org that sponsors the city office gets to count their stats. So, if a city office has hardly any stats and it closes, the org hardly notices it and it does not affect any stats at Int level (slappy's stats) so it would hardly be noticed. A good sized org can make the stats of a small city office in a day or even half a day.

Don't get me wrong, its still a "win". Its just not the magnitude of win as maybe you thought.

I wonder what happened to Lynn Peters. She seemed like a really nice lady. She played in the local symphony but I forget what instrument. Maybe the cello.
There are a few things I can clarify and correct for you.

I was a staff member at Lynn Peters' city office back in the mid 90s. The city office was a satellite of the Miami org and was named Carolina Dianetics. It was located on the outskirts of Winston-Salem NC, not in Greensboro. It was a regular residential home and Lynn lived there. The course room and the sauna for the purif were in the basement. Upstairs bedrooms and the living room served as auditing rooms. Here is the address: 2896 Shiloh Church Road Winston Salem NC 27105. Google street view for this location is from 2007 and you can still see the wooden sign that says Dianetics and Scientology (I believe it has since been taken down, but I'm not sure) and the Dianetics van is parked on the lawn!

Lynn was the Principal Double Bassist of the Winston-Salem Symphony and she founded the The Winston-Salem Youth Symphony.

Post Reply

Return to “Opinions & Debate”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 11 guests