Tad, the "outspoken" scientologist, from D.C.

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bubbler
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Re: Tad, the "outspoken" scientologist, from D.C.

Post by bubbler » Mon Aug 08, 2011 6:25 pm

RAARRRR. What's on your mind, DC? Don't go beating around the bush!
:mrgreen:

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Re: Tad, the "outspoken" scientologist, from D.C.

Post by Don Carlo » Mon Aug 08, 2011 6:42 pm

If Shelly Miscavige is held "at CST" that could mean Trementina Base in New Mexico, or in California: Twin Peaks, Mile High & Sunset View.* Since these sites are closely guarded, it's near-impossible to figure out where Shelly is, really. But she is for sure not in view where regular Scientologists work and play. She's not by Miscavige's side at anniversary balls or org openings, like the one you went to in DC, Tad. As an insider, Tad, your memories would be appreciated. Maybe you never heard her name - maybe Miscavige liked "just himself" in official CoS photos and events. But the earlier generation definitely knew her. Your own parents and older Washington execs saw her come and... go. Mary Shuttleworth, who oozes human rights, must have personally known her, and keeps silent about her mysterious absence and likely forced imprisonment. You may think, well, Shelly "agreed" to some gilded cage situation, so no harm no foul. But what was Shelly's REAL choice? Miscavige can't let her divorce him, because she gets 50% of his assets, and courts would have to determine what those assets are. Miscavige would also lose Scientology-is-family-friendly credibility, with a messy divorce. Miscavige has all the power, money, ruthlessness, and religious authority (saying disloyalty means excommunication), so Shelly is likely not happy, cut off from all her former friends and stripped of a powerful role at CoS.

*CoS Organization Charts, Footnote A2, viewtopic.php?f=9&t=31561

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Re: Tad, the "outspoken" scientologist, from D.C.

Post by Don Carlo » Tue Aug 09, 2011 11:03 pm

Tad, do you dismiss ex-Scientologists as SP's (Suppressive Persons), and "apostates" whose horror stories you can ignore?
A quote, from a CoS member defending against ex-Scientologist accusations
She said the defectors’ stories were like what you would hear “if I asked your ex-husband what he thought of you.”
The ex-Scientologist's reply:
This is nothing like marriage and divorce -- unless someone can have tens of thousands of ex-spouses!

What the church is fighting is thousands of ex-churchies who are all telling the same stories about the greedy demand for money, money, money coupled with pervasive lies and a consistent failure to deliver anything that the church has promised. More importantly, the church is fighting hundreds of Scientologists who worked at the highest levels of the church who are all telling the same stories about crimes, physical and mental abuse, human rights violations, lies and fraud by the Church of Scientology -- even by David Miscavige personally.

This is absolutely nothing like a disgruntled ex-spouse. Come on, nobody should be falling for that analogy!

The Church of Scientology desperately wants reporters to equate these incredibly serious charges with a private marital spat.

A few reporters fall for it. But not many, and fewer every day.

The charges levelled by these Scientology whistle-blowers are very, very serious. And it should be noted by everyone that the Church of Scientology has presented nothing except tricks to answer these accusations. They use loaded language, vague, unsubstantiated slander and misdirection instead of actually confronting and addressing the whistle-blowers' accusations. This is quite significant.

They will not answer these serious charges. They will not open up their compounds and their "RPF" prison camps for inspection.
from Ask the Scientologist http://askthescientologist.blogspot.com ... s-and.html

What's ironic is that CoS brushes away every kind of critic. Ex-Scientologists are accused of being disgruntled, and Never-Been-Scientologists are ignorant, even if they interviewed hundreds of people. CoS's remaining loyal workers and members appear to shut out the critics, listen only to each other, and stay in their bubble. What's really in their hearts and minds, as they wonder about Shelley Miscavige or why the orgs are empty? We may not find out until CoS collapses from scandal and lawsuits.
Last edited by Don Carlo on Wed Aug 10, 2011 1:35 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Tad, the "outspoken" scientologist, from D.C.

Post by bagelboi » Wed Aug 10, 2011 1:21 am

I'd be surprised that Tad would talk to anyone connected with the anti-Scientology movement here or elsewhere such as on Tony Ortega's column. Isn't it a suppressive act to interact with SP's if you aren't an authorized terminal? Maybe he is authorized.

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Re: Tad, the "outspoken" scientologist, from D.C.

Post by Don Carlo » Wed Aug 10, 2011 1:32 am

My conversation with Tad is for anyone in Scientology monitoring this site, or any Scientologist sneaking a peek.

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Re: Tad, the "outspoken" scientologist, from D.C.

Post by Smurf » Wed Aug 10, 2011 1:51 am

Don Carlo wrote:My conversation with Tad is for anyone in Scientology monitoring this site, or any Scientologist sneaking a peek.
Have you considered creating a "dummy" email account and comm'ing with him on his website?

MY KIDS - PHOTOS BY MONTH

Now that I’m accumulating a wealth of cute photos of my two kids, I figured I’d do a little page from 0-2 yrs old, comparing them by months. My son is now 6 months old, and my daughter will be a mighty Two at the end of August.

http://www.scientologyparent.com/my-kid ... by-months/

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Re: Tad, the "outspoken" scientologist, from D.C.

Post by Don Carlo » Wed Aug 10, 2011 9:33 pm

Interesting idea to use a dummy e-mail, but Tad's an internet expert and I'm not, so I'd worry about being traced.

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Re: Tad, the "outspoken" scientologist, from D.C.

Post by Don Carlo » Thu Aug 11, 2011 2:06 am

When CoS was asked for an organizational chart, they said it was impossible. CoS, who always praises the virtue of org charts for its W.I.S.E. businesses, doesn't have or want a comprehensive chart for itself. Instead they bury investigators with tales of sailing the Mediterranean, platitudes, vast lists of organizations, a few simplistic disjointed legal charts, and tangled charts of Sea Org "ecclesiastical" hierarchy. After a fruitless search, I created my own CoS Organization Charts at viewtopic.php?f=9&t=31561 . Footnotes there explain details. If you're a Field Staff Member under a Central Org (Washington, DC) your relationship is:

Church of Spiritual Technology (CST) and Religious Technology Center (RTC)
- - copyrights - - trademarks- - -
Church of Scientology International (CSI)
Executive Strata International
International Management Executive Committee
Flag Command Bureaux
Flag Bureau
Central Org (in your case Washington, DC)
Field Staff Member (you, Tad)

If you are a Field Staff Member through a mission, that mission reports to Scientology Missions International, which reports to Flag Command Bureaux, and then upward as above.

Tad, if you are a Field Staff Member, you are a marketer and have a contractual relationship with this vast conglomerate, even though you view yourself as an innocent volunteer. When CoS is shown to be criminal, your reputation will suffer.

Experienced staff will point out that the above chain of command is not "how it works." I agree that Sea Org's "ecclesiastical" hierarchy is the true power; many CoS high-level companies require employees to be Sea Org. But, notice that there is not a "Sea Org" part of this chart. Sea Org does not have a legal existence - it is a "brotherhood." The above chain of command, and the Chart itself, is from CoS filings, mostly with the IRS, and links to those filings are on the footnotes, the second post at viewtopic.php?f=9&t=31561 . Sea Org hopes to have it both ways - total "ecclesiastic" power and zero legal responsibility since their legal existence is vaporous. The structure of CST, RTC, CSI, etc. was created hoping to impress critics and courts that CSI is not connectable to CST and RTC, but CSI's utter dependence on copyrights and trademarks, and CSI's funneling of vast sums of money to CST, show a deep relationship. A successful lawsuit would prove this relationship, which is why CoS will do anything to settle rather than allow a lawsuit to reach through CSI to CST.

The CoS Organization Chart thread has several insider and outsider charts as well, with discussion. They are best viewed with a wide screen, otherwise text runs on to the next line. Comments are always welcome.

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Re: Tad, the "outspoken" scientologist, from D.C.

Post by Don Carlo » Fri Aug 12, 2011 12:01 am

Tad, how come most young course-buying Scientologists are second generation? In the old days young people from outside joined Scientology; not anymore. Young people watch late night comedians skewer Scientology; they're less impressed by the 1950's e-meter now that they have Ipods, cell phones, and the Internet. They Google everything - Tad, you Google Scientology now, and you'll see the fifth hit is Marty Rathbun's site, and within the top dozen hits are a couple of critic sites. Now, go to Google, click Images and type in Scientology, and you see a sea of mockery. On Youtube and Twitter, a young person musing about his first visit to a Scientology org will get warnings from buddies. CoS lures in desperate job-seekers into org jobs, but many quit when they realize the wages are well below minimum wage.
Look around at the young people that YOU know in Scientology, and figure out the percentage that are second generation. Many will say I joined of my own free will to better myself, quit a bad habit, etc. Nobody in their twenties wants to admit their mommy or daddy dragged them in. But, if you get to know them better, you'll find that's often the case, and sadly, sometimes the parent(s) quit and the young person is stuck in Scientology, maybe even disconnected from those parents. CoS's active paying members were once young; now the average is pushing middle age.

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Re: Tad, the "outspoken" scientologist, from D.C.

Post by bubbler » Fri Aug 12, 2011 6:40 am

Thanks for your advice to Linux and me, Don Carlo. I've applied your recommendations. Keep telling it.

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Re: Tad, the "outspoken" scientologist, from D.C.

Post by Don Carlo » Fri Aug 12, 2011 8:30 pm

Tad, your family had the money to send you to Delphi, where you rubbed elbows with other teens, many of whose parents were Scientologists. Did any end up in Sea Org? College? Unknown? Most private residential schools have extremely close friendships that last decades. I hope you keep in touch, and get back in touch, with many of your friends. I see you attended Oregon State 1994-95, so I assume you didn't graduate, or you would name your bachelor's degree and major on linked-in*. How many of those Delphi buddies even attended a good university like Oregon State? How many have had your success - a good job, an intact family and energy for outside activities? Of those, how many are active public Scientologists (not frazzled staff) ? I would guess in the US there are less than a hundred under-forty educated professional family-man active-public-Scientologists like you. So, you are a kind of leader for the under-forties. In fact, you could lead the under-forties public OUT of that Washington org.

*http://www.linkedin.com/in/thaddeusreeves
**What were you doing 1995-1998, where linked-in has a gap? Org Staff?

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Re: Tad, the "outspoken" scientologist, from D.C.

Post by Don Carlo » Sat Aug 13, 2011 10:47 pm

Tad, you're pushing middle-aged. You're about 36, since you left Oregon State after two years, in 1995, presumably as a 20-year-old.
The US Census lists middle age as including both the age categories 35 to 44 and 45 to 50, while prominent social scientist, Erik Erikson, sees it ending a little later and defines middle adulthood as between 40 and 65.
*

You likely "feel young" with your young children, but you were 35+ when you had the second one. My parents, 35+ years older, felt ancient to me when I was a teen; in ten years your children will roll their eyes at your embarassing out-of-date slang, ideas, and "good old days" stories.

I have seen with my own Scientology public relative, how a second-generation child can be lured out of college to work for Scientology, and face a life of poverty, and probably not even be able to afford a child. There is a strong anti-education strain in CoS which discourages college for the tuition cost (since CoS feels the money should go to Scientology courses and charities) and the likely encounter with "jokers and degraders" who mock Scientology. For those who are regular staff or public, this creates a demographic drop among second generation Scientologists if they can't afford a child until their late thirties, when infertility can strike, or if they never can afford a child. If the second generation child joins Sea Org, of course, they are not allowed to reproduce. Since few youngsters joins CoS who have never-been-Scientologists, you have an aging population.

Scientology may "feel" young because the staff is young, but often these are second generation who, without a useful college degree, have few options. You know that outsiders who join staff rarely last. What other negative signs are happening? The staff is young because the dedicated "young staff" of five or ten years ago have quit, because (1) poverty is less tolerable at age 35; (2) some workers were outspoken and that got them fired, and (3) some got sucked into Sea Org. So, even the youthfullness of the staff is a warning sign that there is no long-term career possible in most orgs. Because the second generation isn't making babies enough, there will be a very small third generation to become staff or public members.

Look at the people taking courses - look for people you know in CoS magazine completion lists. Many names are over 40; the youngsters may be the second generation whose parents are still buying them courses. And, finally, look at the public and staff whose deaths are mentioned in Scientology magazines. It's appalling how many are in their mid-fifties. I'm not saying Scientology hastened their demises; but it didn't even get them the average life expectancy of 78 years in the US.** The future is an aging and shrinking group.

In the early days, young auditors had cute young starry-eyed people to audit. My over-fifty CoS relative has learned all the right phrases to act enthusiastic, but is no longer-starry-eyed or a possible mate for a twenty-year-old auditor. You've got pretty buildings, but public with wrinkled hands and liver spots.
*http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Middle_age
**http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Life_Expectancy_by_Country

Don Carlo
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Re: Tad, the "outspoken" scientologist, from D.C.

Post by Don Carlo » Sun Aug 14, 2011 7:04 pm

Tad, if you think CoS will protect your children against "psych" drugs, think of the Scientologists that you know take herbal drugs. Some herbal medicines, cigarettes, and coffee are psychoactive:
St. John's Wort: blocks serotonin reuptake, similar to Prozac
Ginkgo: increases acetylcholine activity, similar to Tacrine or Cognex.
Panax Ginseng: increases acetylcholine, similar to Tacrine and other anti-Alzheimer's drugs.
Kava: enhances neurotransmitter GABA activity, similar to Valium and Xanax (Kava kava banned some places; may cause liver damage)
Alcohol: increases dopamine, similar to Wellbutrin
Nicotine: (cigarettes) increases dopamine, similar to Wellbutrin
Caffeine: (Coffee, tea, and some soda) stimulates the central nervous system; Wikipedia says it is
the world's most widely consumed psychoactive substance
My point is not that coffee, or ginseng, or beer are BAD, just that the Scientologists are altering their brain cells with these substances, while they preach against "psych drugs" that ALSO target serotonin, dopamine, and other neurotransmitters.

I wrote this summary over ten years ago; New herbs are being sold, often in mixtures, by Scientologist-run vitamin shops; I will be researching these soon.

This is a summary of the thread Herbal Medicines are Psychoactive, Too, with sources for the substances' psycho-active effects. The thread is at
viewtopic.php?t=3763

Don Carlo
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Re: Tad, the "outspoken" scientologist, from D.C.

Post by Don Carlo » Tue Aug 16, 2011 4:45 am

Tad, ever wonder why so many people try Scientology and quit? One reason is that people who are easily hypnotizable find Scientology more rewarding, but people who are hard to hypnotize find it pointless and intrusive. Hubbard was a hypnotist in early days, and used many of its techniques (like starting each session with a ritual phrase "this is the session.") He used the term "reverie" but started saying Scientology wasn't hypnosis, partly to add to the mystique. He defined hypnosis as a zombie puppet-like state, and of course that doesn't happen in auditing or courses. What does happen is exaggerated suggestibility, and real hypnotists will say that exaggerated suggestibility IS hypnosis.
The personality trait for being easily hypnotized is low personal boundaries, according to scientific studies. This is a person who borrows things and doesn't mind being borrowed from, and who isn't very touchy about personal space, and who will confess secrets easily. Now this is where families get ripped apart, because often one sibling will have high personal boundaries, and the other will have low boundaries. This can mean, despite being coaxed into auditing and courses, a teen with a high personal barrier will reject it, while his or her sibling, with low personal boundaries, will love it and feel validated. But if in addition the two argue about Scientology, the sibling who becomes the loyal Scientologist will have to report the critical sibling, and likely will be advised to "handle" the sibling and, if the sibling won't shut up about Scientology's faults, the loyal Scientologist will have to disconnect.

So, think about your own family and friends. Who's the "don't touch my stuff" and "none of your business" person? That person is likely to leave Scientology. Look into the future. Do you see a disconnection ahead?

For sources and more discussion:
Hypnosis is "what works" in Scientology at viewtopic.php?f=9&t=4221&
More proof hypnosis works - Scientific American at viewtopic.php?f=9&t=3918
This message board has over twenty-four hundred posts that mention hypnosis. Hypnosis can't be brushed away.

Don Carlo
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Re: Tad, the "outspoken" scientologist, from D.C.

Post by Don Carlo » Tue Aug 16, 2011 10:02 pm

Tad, are you noticing a lot of foreigners as CoS staff? Not the older Aussies, Kiwis, Brits, and Western Europeans, but people from Eastern Europe and impoverished countries. Isn't that odd? There is evidence that CoS lures them here with tales of becoming ministers, gets them in under religious worker rules, confiscates their passports (which is illegal) and then puts them to work on non-ministerial work, like cleaning toilets. My earlier post talked about the shortage of workers willing to work for below minimum wage, so this is evidence that the US orgs can't recruit enough US citizens. The foreign workers are often poor and uneducated, don't know their rights, and are told to obey or be deported. Is this fair?

For more, US Immigration questioning Sea Org "Religious Worker" quals at viewtopic.php?f=11&t=33036
and
New changes to religious worker program, Nov 2008 report at viewtopic.php?f=9&t=29756

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