PS: Of course having the Grand Mal Seizures for 6 months or so after being routed out of the Sea Org to get off of my medication didn't help, either.
Those F*** morons. If you have a medical condition, don't...........do NOT.....
listen to auditors, ethics officers, or the endless idiots who act as know-it-alls within
C of S.

Go see a Doctor: PERIOD.

Tory/Magoo!

Dear Kate,
I posted this earlier but it got erased. I'm going to try again.
I was so sorry to hear your story. especially how it ended for your husdand and how that left you adn your children.

I just returned from Chicago where i spent some time with Laura Bashaw. I do not know if you are familiar with her and her husbands story, but it is very similar to yours. If you would like to get connected, let me know at snowshdw@aol.com.

There are too many people that have lost their minds through scientology. Myself included. Some may not be still here to speak, but those of us who did survive are healing and gathering. It's time OSA stopped hiding this sort of thing in the closet, and began to take responsibility.

take care,
nancy

Nancy, Welcome to OCMB, you sound like you understand just how bad scientology really is. I was in for years, myself. Thank you for caring and posting here, people really need to know what scientology does to people and families.

In my opinion, scientology and especially the upper levels, were designed by a paranoid schizophrenic and the "Bridge" leads straight to total madness, NOT "total freedom". (Unless you consider total freedom from your mind to be a worthy goal).

A couple weeks ago Tigger posted Greg Bashaws story, Here is the header, you can find the whole story in the "Moderated" section under "Topics", the Thread is near the bottom of the page.

I wrote part of my own story there, and Kate? I hope you read it too. This is not an isolated incident, and you are so right Nancy when you said:

"There are too many people that have lost their minds through scientology. Myself included. Some may not be still here to speak, but those of us who did survive are healing and gathering. It's time OSA stopped hiding this sort of thing in the closet, and began to take responsibility".

Love, Ladybird

Here is the header: "Greg Bashaw*Death of a Scientologist"
By:
Senior Member
Username: Tigger

Post Number: 5059
Registered: 11-2000
Posted on Monday, April 25, 2005 - 5:33 am:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
DEATH OF A SCIENTOLOGIST

by Tori Marlan
Chicago READER * August, 2002

Another great source of information on this subject is:

www.whyaretheydead.com Mike Gormez hosts this site, and there are way too many similiar stories of deaths and suicides there.

(Sorry, I am way behind the 8-ball in terms of using my computer, but please forgive me, I was locked up in the Sea Org during the real world "Tech Age", so I can't do the hyperlinks properly yet, but this site is on OC, and can also be googled.)

Here's the link
Greg Bashaw * Death of a Scientologis...

.............
Ladybird,

go to the page you want to link to
1. right-click with your mouse on the page
2. a selection list opens
3. choose quality (or maybe you call it characteristics in English? Well, it's the last on the list)
4. a window opens
5. in the window you find an address field
6. copy the address
7. go to the new message where you want to put in the link
8. in your message press on the link icon (the one with the globe and a link. You find it left of the smiley) - a little window opens
8. paste in the address of the page you want to link to
9. press OK

And voilá ........you got a link to the page in your message

Best,
Sarah

LadyBird, I've read parts of your story and we may know eachother (in real life).
My story is onClamBake,,, in the personal stories section -- Kathryn Speaks, that's me. I still like the protection of the pseudonym, though since the hearing in CW it is not too difficult to figure out that Kathryn is me.

There as survivors,, and as soon as we are healed enough, we will be taking actions -- unless in the meantime this type of thing stops. (I can still have some hope)...

nancy

Hi Nancy,

good to see you posting here. OC is lucky to have your insights available.

Watching scientology and scientologists trying to pretend and play around with the mind is like watching a gorilla try to play a stradivarius. You know it is only a short while until something unique and valuable will be wrecked.

Mick, thanks for the welcome...I don't talk much,,, but Kate's story is just so moving and so tragic. AND I'm sorry to say, it is also not a new story and she and her family are not the only ones.

I was a staff member at Int 20 years ago. And I was privy to all the Psycho cases around the world. Managmenet would be informed of all "flaps" and a type three was definitely considered a flap. I must say, they existed, but not in the numbers they happen now. ALSO,,, the interesting thing to me is that these are HIGH level, LONG term Scientologists that are losing it. With all the tech, you would expect long term members to be improving,, not going batty.

I don't think that the current Int Managment has anyone trained on the Data Series, becuase these stats reflect an outness you can drive a truck through, and the amount of money spent on court cases and lawyers and abuse of the victims, is a complete wrong target and waste of membership money.

It scares me, the stats that I personally know of -- of people who have been driven this far. It has got to be in 'affluence'.... and there appears to be NO recognition of internal outnesses from on high.

At least when I was at Int, if we had a Type Three come out of an HGC, we knew the Organization had made some sort of mistake.....
We might not have outright admitted it, but what we wouldn't have defended it either.

too bad no one at Int read the data series...

Int now thinks that an Attack means that they are doing well,,,,

I bet they think that the more Type Three's, the better the technical delivery....



nancy

Hi Nancy,
They are nuts and have been ever since I got involved in 1969. They really believe that reality is agreement and that if a bunch of scientologists agree on something they will change reality. Like in 1979-80 the CofS lost a court case and they were celebrating as if they had won the court case. I must have still had some sanity as I thought this was crazy.

In 1979, Diana Hubbard said that Mexico was the first clear country. There had been a few elite Mexicans that had gone clear and Diana's reality was that Mexico was now clear. It must have been in the genes. She was crazy too. Hubbard must have hated reality as he was always trying to change it. Someday we will indeed learn that Total Freedom is Total Acceptance. God is reality and the highest reality. When we are one with reality we are one with ourselves and our creator. It is actually perfect. I have been there and a class X11 invalidated this experience. Heaven isn't heaven if you get there without scientology. I did and scientology can't and won't get you there.

Kathryn, I read your story and I wish you lots of healing, harmony , peace, joy, and a wholeness that you have never felt before. There is so much truth outside of scientology and so many wonderful people. You are Love. We are all Love just a little bit different from each other. We all have our own vibration. We have all been so deceived by scientology. You did nothing wrong! We did nothing wrong, we only wanted a better world and a better life. We will have a better life even without scientology!!
Take care, Sea Ogre


(Message edited by Sea Ogre on May 10, 2005)

sea ogre,
thanks for your thoughts... I agree, there are so many wonderful people outside of scientology. My epiphany came when I was listening to the Dalai Lama explain why he woudln't attack his neighbor (china), no matter what.

Kindness and compassion have to be created and chosen in thought and deed on a daily basis.... some days on an hourly basis. It is not easy, but just as the black and white thinking in Scn is what cut us off from so much, we can't then become the opposite, just cause we are out.

I don't know where we came from,,, or where we go when we die, but I do know that our job while we are here is to prmote Love, and manifest our individual vibrations of love. I agree completely with your thought that Total Freedom is Total Acceptance.

I think it is a Budhist definition of Suffering that says "Suffering is wishing things to be different than they are."
Radical Acceptance is the road to peace.

thanks for your kind thoughts
blessings,
Kathryn (aka nancy)

Scientology makes people stupid!

It accomplishes this by causing a person to be numb to his/her feelings and intuitions which by the way are a natural gift from our creator. Scientology teaches one that human emotions are bad. LRH hated human emotions and reactions. One is trained to ignore these feelings and keep his/her TRs in, (like Terril does). One is trained to not listen to others but only listen to LRH. LRH said he always got into trouble when he listened to others so he taught us to not listen to others but only pretend to (like an auditor using TRO). We were brain washed into not listening to our feelings and our higher selves. We therefore lost touch with ourself and our intuition and we used Hubbards' policies instead. These were our new truths and this is what we must listen to. Keeping scientology working was our training. This caused a break from ourself.
This my friends is something we must each remedy. We must return to self. This is our power and our truth. Our intuition and our feelings must again be trusted. We know what is right. We know what is true.

As Abraham has said over and over again "It is our absolute promise to you that when you understand the power of feeling good now, no matter what, you will hold the key to the achievement of any state of being, any state of health, any state of wealth, or any state of anything that you desire."

Our feelings are important and it is important that we feel GOOD! We are not robots. TRs make us into robots, they don't make us better listeners.
We listen with our hearts, not just our minds, but in scientology we close our hearts, close our minds and listen only to Hubbard. We were trained to not need our minds, just tech and trs. It is like once you meet one scientologist, you meet them all. They all sing the same song and don't want to listen to any one else's music. When they start to sing their own song is when they start getting out and free.

My hope is that we all can sing our own song without fear or invalidation. Maybe that is what we came here to do. It is certainly monotonous singing the same song, jeeze let's be creative!

I was a scientologist. It made me stupid!

Hi Kathryn,
My favorite teacher, Abraham, says that when we die we are liquid LOVE and it is as great as it can get. We should not be afraid as we really don't die. It surely sounds good to me and it is comforting and has definitely lessened my fear and resistance toward dying. Abraham says resistance causes death, disease,and illness.

nancy.......

How fun to see you here, posting

I know you've been around for some time, but it's good to have you posting here now. (We're good friends, and she's the best...no question about it, but then you all are, too

I love you guys!:)

Tory/Magoo~~

hey nancy,

so good to see you posting as well!

you have great insights to share. thanks for all your
support!

lucy:)

Sea Ogre you said it about Scientology teaching not to have emotions. I had this strange idea that I could not be sympathetic as it would restimulate someone. So all this time I never given my children sympathy. What a horrible thing to realize.

I have more compassion for people now then when I was in Scientology. Isn't it great to actually enjoy life now and have your dreams come true.