Nobody is a waste of time, unless you don't feel you exist without the attention of others.

I don't even know where to start on this subject, it is very complex.

Sometimes I feel that I have nothing more to give, but someone or something reminds me of what I have given, and that I have more to give, even if it just money or attention or advice. Sometimes I have given to people who did not deserve what I gave. Sometimes I haven't given enough to those who deserved more.

Or I remember really bad times and feeling hopeless and useless and all of a sudden turning a corner in my life and it is like the monsoon stopped and the sun came out and everything is fresh and new and smells really really good.

Suicide is a permanent solution to a temporary problem.

Just pull the covers over your head and stay in bed until you feel like getting up. If you don't have any covers or a bed, sleep under a bridge or a picnic table. Right now "Under the Boardwalk" came on the radio. One of the best most honest soul baring times I ever experienced was when I fell asleep in the arms of a man I barely knew under a bridge. He is still my husband almost 30 years later and the magic is still there despite all the curves life threw at us.

Sometimes, you DON'T know what you had till it's gone. Sometimes you can't imagine how important you are to others. Sometimes, you don't know what is around the next corner. Sometimes the only reason to get up in the morning is to see what some asshole posted on the net!

I DO understand, I think, or at least as well as one person can feel empathy for another. We are all here together and none of us are getting out of here alive.

It is just a matter of how and when.

I really hope to leave this world a little better off than I found it for my having been here. My definition of "better" has changed from clearing the planet to helping one person one day at a time.

Toney, obviously you are succcesful enough to have a computer and internet access. That is alot of power right there.

Obviously you are literate. We are at the cusp of exposing scientolgogy, and helping others who might be vulnerable due to their age or a background such as yours from jumping out the frying pan into the fire.

Scientology cannot help anyone, scientology preys on the young or wounded and takes advantage of people and rips them off.

Sorry, I am repeating myself, but please look up scientology and suicide on google, and the "why are they dead site" and search suicide and black dianetics and reverse processinng here on xenu.net.

You should know all the facts before you make any decision.

All my best, Ladybird

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Dear Toney,
Abraham, my favorite teacher, has said that a person can't be right while making another wrong. I agree.

There are two ways I know of for starting a new life !. Die and 2. Forgive everyone including yourself. I do know that if you die you will forgive all others or you can do it now and start your new life. The choice is yours.

Did God put you here to kill yourself or to heal yourself?

I just completely healed myself from a divorce from my exwife. I was crazy about her and had 18 years of happy marriage even though we were crazy scientologist for many years. I wouldn't forgive her and wouldn't let go of the hurt and pain.
She wronged me and by God I wasn't letting go of that. I finally did. I decided to Love her through it all. I am now very free and very happy and I went to see her on my way back from my Alaska trip. It went great and I knew I was healed and it surely didn't take scientology to do it. We are now back in communication. Forgiveness works! You might even want to forgive God while your at it.

You can start a new and beautiful life as I have done or you can check out. I don't believe in death. I do believe in life as we were given eternal life. So, sorry to dissapoint you in that you can't really kill yourself. When you die you will be liquid Love and fully conscious and please don't worry about Hubbard's implant stations, they were just his and no one elses.

You will feel great when you die, the trick is to feel great while you are in the physical. That's why you came? Remember?

Fix your life, live your life and if you aren't having fun then you are probably trying to live someone elses life.

Sea Ogre

Very well said, Sea Ogre!

I will only add............yes....in my OPINION .... a person will feel good when they die, if they've lived out their life.

It is my opion, having known a few young people who took their own lives, that this is a way different story. One was very confused, sorry, didn't realize it would be SO "Finite", at least that was the perception I got from this being, having taken their own life.

I agree with Sea Ogre....forgive yourself, Toney, and others who you may still be fighting. Give up the ghosts...and start lving.

Remember that line: Get busy living, or get busy dying?
I recommend for you that you get busy living.

My guess is you have quite a few more doors to walk through, and they may just bring you wonderment. Find the light...Toney...here on Earth, right near you.


Tory/Magoo~~

Toney,

Tell me why you would take your own assumptions about death (the end of suffering, the end of selfishness, the end of everything) as definitive and binding? You're talking from personal experience no doubt? ; )
Everyone's decision how and IF to live is their own, and I respect that, but isn't it logical that if there's a even the remote possibility that the results of suicide are worse (or exactly the same) than the suffering one feels in life, it would make sense to at least investigate that more fully before making a decision one way or another? It's a huge gamble after all...
I've known a couple of people who have killed themselves, and while I don't know what happened to them afterward, I do know what happened to everyone who loved them. That's not being said to guilt you, that's just my experience... one's decision to live or not is truly their own, and I myself don't feel anyone should be judged for it. I won't be bothering you anymore about this. I just didn't feel right about not mentioning to you that you don't really know if death will achieve whatever you believe it will no matter how much you try to convince yourself that you do.
You seem like a very decent, sensitive guy, Toney, and I appreciate you taking the time to reply. Whatever you decide... vaya con Dios, amigo.

love,
jack

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Toney, I have been reading this thread from the beginning, and have not commented until now. I respect your right to do what you want, even though I may not agree with it. I also enjoy reading your posts as they are usually very well thought out. I must admit that I agree with you on your stance on liver implants not going to someone who uses/abuses alcohol, and being used to save the life of someone else. And I appreciate the fact that you, instead of looking for a bridge to jump off of or a bottle of pills to take, are planning to let nature take it's course on your body. I do want you to know that there are a few around here (other than the ones that have already stated so) that appreciate your posts and your insights. I considered pm'ing this to you, but instead thought that I'd say it in the open thread. I hope to see you around for a while longer.

Rick (hboats)

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Toney, you are a muckracker and no-holds-barred instigator in
the proud tradition of Pitbull.

Now you understand why Scientology would love folks like you to just give up and "check out".

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An Elephants butt? Why would I want to do something like that?

You mean like that guy who started that cult a few years back... what was His name again? Oh yeah... Yeshua... I think they call Him "Jesus" now...
I'm not personally wanting you to follow or believe anything. I put those quotes out there so you could make a more informed decision. I just made you aware of the theory. You have to decide whether you believe it or not. Meher Baba doesn't want anyone proselytising and I don't. I wouldn't off handedly dismiss everything every "so called master/guru," says though or any human for that matter, unless I had all of the answers myself. I use my own powers of discernment to learn from everyone as best as I can.



I don't belong to any religion. God and me don't need one. We get along just fine. Not that there's anything wrong with someone who follows religion... but infinite God can't really be confined to rules doctrines, etc... by His very definition, God is beyond the limits of everything...



With all due respect to you, Toney, of course he was right when he said that because it's pure redundancy... It basically says "What's true for you is true for you."
Who can argue with that?
But I would add that what's true for us may not be THE Truth... the Truth/God doesn't need someone to believe it. It is what it is regardless. The same can be said for non-truth... no matter how many believe it, it won't make it so. I would have to have more than a HOPE for oblivion to gamble on suicide, but that's just me.



Yes, but where do love, compassion, & forgiveness fit in with killing yourself?



Geez, Toney... at least base your end on a decent film! That was one of the most boring deaths in screen history... Nic Cage can be good sometimes and terrible other times... Maybe you could make your exit like "The Iron Giant" saving the world from nuclear destruction...

jack

U-Boats said,
And I appreciate the fact that you, instead of looking for a bridge to jump off of or a bottle of pills to take, are planning to let nature take it's course on your body.
BB
Jeez! I know here that jumping off bridges is the cool thing to do here an 'all. But they were made for crossing! Ah!!! the misuse of tools is the perennial story of mankinds prediliction for squirrelling.

Like" peace comes from the barrel of a gun."

And Toney, "leaving los vegas" was a GREAT movie. Would that you be so lucky to find a whore like Elisabeth Shue.

Talk about heart of gold!

You can do whatever you want to your body. I understand from your original message that you dont want sympathy, but empathy (empathy is where you put yourself in the other persons shoes but don't feel sorry). It seems like you got a good deal of sympathy and you appreciated it. Good. I've had clinical depression before, most people have, chronic depression must be debilitating. Sucks to be you!
No, that's not what I mean by this post, my previous comments were in ernest, but that is essentially what Tigger, J. Swift, and Ass Mike typed. Swift, Mike, Tigger: you might be trying tough love, but seriously, who cares? What you wrote was stupid. Your idiots.
Especially Umike. Idiot.
Even if he was trying to get attention, what does it bother you to just not respond, not give him attention?
If you think sympathy is for the weak minded then you should just die. No one will have any sympathy for you. Maybe you did try to help, but you did a bad job.

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