The time now is Tue Feb 09, 2010 6:32 am
All times are GMT + 2 Hours
|
| Author |
Message |
Sponge
Joined: 10 Apr 2006
Posts: 8442
Location: U.K.
|
 Posted: Thu Mar 26, 2009 4:18 am Post subject:
|
|
|
SM, it's a default for all Sea Org members of which it's batshit insane creator, His Wobbiness L. Ron Hubbard, is included, that they are coming back not just once but many times over next billion years until their reincarnation contract runs out (I'm sure they'll be given the option on a further billion years if the planet still hasn't been cleared yet).
 (Official scientology literature with Sea Org motto: "We come back")
and pigs will fly
_________________
http://forums.whyweprotest.net
www.whyaretheydead.info
REMEMBER: WWW.TRUTHRUNDOWN.ORG
Last edited by Sponge on Thu Mar 26, 2009 4:21 am; edited 2 times in total |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
SuzanneMarie
Joined: 25 May 2006
Posts: 2938
Location: Pacific Northwest
|
| Posted: Thu Mar 26, 2009 4:20 am Post subject:
|
|
|
| Don Carlo wrote: | | My Scientology relative was always running off to courses; definitely more than once a week. |
You're missing the point. Someone on course goes in on weekends and evenings or during the day, Monday-Friday. When they are not on course or getting auditing, they don't go in the org, unless as a volunteer or to attend an event, wedding, funeral, etc. Christians go to church one day a week.
| Don Carlo wrote: |
I understand that CoS isn't run like a typical Protestant church, but it seems to take about two hundred churchgoers to support a full time minister and a full-time religious ed director, so that's about 1 full-time worker per hundred churchgoers. Even if there remain 4,000 Scientologists in the Western US who have been actively donating, volunteering, and taking courses for over a year (which I doubt)* that would mean they could support 40 workers across all the headquarters, Gold, orgs and missions in the western US. |
It does not take 200 churchgoers to support a CoS mission or org. A dozen or so people on lines, doing various services, will do it, depending on what courses or services they are doing and what the org or mission has for expenses. Even if the org had to pay staff minimum wage, it still would not take 200 active parishioners to support a mission or org.
I'm laughing at your insistence that there are fewer than 4,000 active Scientologists in the Western US. Didn't 5,400 people just show up at the Shrine for an event? Even if we assume that half were newbies or non Scientologists, your guesstimate leaves out all the West US Scientologists out who don't live near the Shrine (which is most of them). |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
SuzanneMarie
Joined: 25 May 2006
Posts: 2938
Location: Pacific Northwest
|
| Posted: Thu Mar 26, 2009 4:23 am Post subject:
|
|
|
| Sponge wrote: | | SM, it's a default for all Sea Org members (SNIP Ad hom), that they are coming back not just once but many times over next billion years until their reincarnation contract runs out |
The contract does not state where they will come back. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Sponge
Joined: 10 Apr 2006
Posts: 8442
Location: U.K.
|
| Posted: Thu Mar 26, 2009 4:23 am Post subject:
|
|
|
Do you count recincarnated ones twice?...or however many times they've "come back".
| SuzanneMarie wrote: | | Sponge wrote: | | SM, it's a default for all Sea Org members (SNIP Ad hom), that they are coming back not just once but many times over next billion years until their reincarnation contract runs out |
The contract does not state where they will come back. |
Where do you think it will be? Teegeeack or Venus? or?
I didn't know L. Ron Hubbard was an "Ad Hom" that had to be snipped.
_________________
http://forums.whyweprotest.net
www.whyaretheydead.info
REMEMBER: WWW.TRUTHRUNDOWN.ORG
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Don Carlo
Joined: 25 Jul 2005
Posts: 4379
|
| Posted: Thu Mar 26, 2009 7:48 pm Post subject:
|
|
|
Suzanne Marie, I can't prove there are fewer than 4,000 people in the Western US who for all of 2008 were either donating, volunteering, working, or buying courses. You can't prove any number, either.
A dozen CoS members may indeed support a mission or an org. But that's because the church members are squeezed harder to buy courses and materials, and to volunteer and donate. The workers are also squeezed by being underpaid. The mission building owner, some hoodwinked public member, is coerced into providing free rent.
This isn't sustainable as the members age. The second and third generation Scientologists may vaguely "belong" but they can't afford to pay much for courses without a college degree and in this economy. Public members like my relative, who still have a good income, are approaching retirement age and health issues, so they have to think hard about donating the rest of their retirement savings to CoS.
I believe most young people raised outside Scientology watch late-night comedians and have been exposed to the Xenu myth and generally mockery. They won't like to be told to self-censor their web-surfing. With fading oldsters, uneducated 2nd & 3rd generation youngsters, a low birth rate, and few young people joining from outside, I see declining CoS membership. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
SuzanneMarie
Joined: 25 May 2006
Posts: 2938
Location: Pacific Northwest
|
| Posted: Fri Mar 27, 2009 3:11 am Post subject:
|
|
|
| Don Carlo wrote: | | Suzanne Marie, I can't prove there are fewer than 4,000 people in the Western US who for all of 2008 were either donating, volunteering, working, or buying courses. You can't prove any number, either. |
A while back Arnie Lerma sent out a postcard to every mission in the US. He got back less than a half-dozen cards from the post office indicating that the mission was gone, and some may have moved to a new address rather than folded.
I dare you to perform the same experiment, and share your results. In 2007 there were more than 60 missions in the western US. If each mission has 200 active members, that's a lot more than 4,000.
| Don Carlo wrote: |
A dozen CoS members may indeed support a mission or an org. But that's because the church members are squeezed harder to buy courses and materials, and to volunteer and donate. The workers are also squeezed by being underpaid. The mission building owner, some hoodwinked public member, is coerced into providing free rent. |
Most missions do not get free rent.
| Don Carlo wrote: |
I believe most young people raised outside Scientology watch late-night comedians and have been exposed to the Xenu myth and generally mockery. They won't like to be told to self-censor their web-surfing. |
Yeah, I always like to go to late-night comedians to form my opinions about things that matter to me.... and I do not self-censor.
Look at me. The things that you imagine cause disaffection, do not.
| Don Carlo wrote: |
With fading oldsters, uneducated 2nd & 3rd generation youngsters, a low birth rate, and few young people joining from outside, I see declining CoS membership. |
Is our birth rate lower than that of nonScientologists? Probably not.
Are our kids uneducated and unemployable? They have the best work ethic and skills, they compare with no other group. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Don Carlo
Joined: 25 Jul 2005
Posts: 4379
|
| Posted: Fri Mar 27, 2009 5:18 am Post subject:
|
|
|
CoS kids probably have more on-the-job experience, with teens working on dangerous construction sites without steel-toed boots or hard hats, and working amidst choking fumes and dust without masks or safety goggles.
I've seen missions in the West with zero cars parked out front. 200 active members per org? I doubt it. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
PTS
Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1415
|
| Posted: Fri Mar 27, 2009 5:33 am Post subject:
|
|
|
| Quote: | Is our birth rate lower than that of nonScientologists? Probably not.
Are our kids uneducated and unemployable? They have the best work ethic and skills, they compare with no other group |
Jeremy Perkins is a scientology child
Jeremy Perkins: A Scientology Family Tragedy
| Quote: | On March 13, 2003, Jeremy Perkins, a 28 year old untreated schizophrenic, stabbed his mother Elli 77 times. She bled to death on her bedroom floor. Jeremy is currently being held at Rochester Psychiatric Center, having been found not responsible for Elli's murder by reason of mental disease or defect.
Perkins, his mother and father, his sister, and her husband are all members of the Church of Scientology, a group that believes modern psychiatric medicine derives from an ancient alien civilization's plot to drug and enslave humanity. Scientologists like Tom Cruise vehemently and publicly oppose the pharmacological treatment of mental illness. Unfortunately, Scientology's own brand of therapy, called "auditing", is worthless.
Elli Perkins was a senior auditor (counselor) at the Church of Scientology of Buffalo, New York. Her son-in-law, Jeff Carlson, was the Executive Director of that church. Jeremy himself had taken Scientology courses there, and was even flown out to Los Angeles to join Scientology's paramilitary Sea Organization, although he was promptly sent back home due to his mental problems.
After consulting a Scientologist osteopath, Dr. Conrad Maulfair, Elli was treating Jeremy with vitamins, which he disliked. Within hours of Elli's murder, which occurred on L. Ron Hubbard's birthday, the Church of Scientology initiated a crash cover-up to hide its connections to the case. Jeremy's family has since "disconnected" from him, per Scientology policy. This web site reveals Scientology's true role in the death of Elli Perkins and the destruction of Jeremy's life |
http://www.cs.cmu.edu/~dst/JeremyPerkins/
Linda Walicki is a scientology child
Scientology Cited in Australian Murders
'I just butchered my family'
| Quote: | The parents of a woman accused of murdering her father and sister apparently declined psychiatric treatment for her last year because of their Scientology beliefs, a report tendered in court states.
|
http://www.smh.com.au/news/national/i-just-butchered-my-family/2007/07/09/1183833402450.html
Quentin Hubbard was "THE" scientology child
| Quote: | Geoffrey Quentin McCaully Hubbard (6 January 1954 – 12 November 1976), was the son of Scientology founder L. Ron Hubbard and his third wife, Mary Sue Hubbard. He died at the age of 22 in an apparent suicide.
After Ron's eldest son Ron Jr. quit Scientology in 1959, Ron chose Quentin as his successor to lead the organization. Quentin went to sea with Ron when he established the Sea Organization, living on the flagship Apollo and reaching the highest level of auditor training. He disagreed with his father's plans, sometimes saying that he wanted to be a pilot,[1] and in 1974 that he would like to be a dancer. Soon after this, a friend found him in the midst of a suicide attempt. Quentin survived this attempt and was assigned to the Rehabilitation Project Force.[2]
Former Scientologists have said that Quentin was homosexual[1][2][3], and that this clearly caused him a great deal of personal torment due to the homophobia of the era. Scientology doctrine classified homosexuals as "sexual pervert[s]" and "quite ill physically."[4] Another source close to him claims that his alleged homosexuality was an act to avoid relationships that his father might not approve.[5] Quentin is described as having had a gentle demeanor, with none of his father's charisma.[1][2]
In 1975 the Sea Org moved to shore in Clearwater, Florida. Quentin was assigned to operations there but was often absent.[2] Police discovered him unconscious in his car in Las Vegas on October 28, 1976, without any identifying documents. L. Ron Hubbard was furious at the news, shouting, "That stupid fucking kid! Look what he's done to me!" Quentin died two weeks later without having regained consciousness.[2] Although there had been a hose from the car's window to the tailpipe, a test for carbon monoxide was negative.[6] Mrs. Hubbard told Scientologists that Quentin had died from encephalitis.[1] L. Ron Hubbard is said to have deteriorated rapidly after Quentin's death, becoming dishevelled and increasingly paranoid.[2]
|
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quentin_Hubbard
_________________
Liber Et Audax |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
brownjedi
Joined: 05 May 2006
Posts: 3220
Location: Phoenix, AZ
|
| Posted: Mon Mar 30, 2009 5:14 pm Post subject:
|
|
|
| SM a cult spokesperson from CST I believe and as I remember it, it was in the parade magazine insert of the Sunday paper....do you read the paper? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
|
Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group
|
OCMB FAQ
FAQ
Search
Register
Last Hour
Operation Clambake
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
Forum index
»
General Topics
»
Opinions & Debate
