Snake Thompson

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caroline
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Re: Snake Thompson

Post by caroline » Tue Oct 26, 2010 11:55 pm

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Col. Consuelo Andrew Seoane wrote:Once it was agreed that, so far as Thompson and I were concerned, I was to be his partner on the first espionage mission into Japan, he went to General Duval, who had just succeeded General Wood. Thompson advised General Duval of his desire to have me accompany him, and after painting a very rosy picture of the operation, approval was granted. A few days later, I was summoned to the Chief of Staff's office, and handed an assignment —to write my own orders. The Chief of Staff dictated to me: "Lt. C. A. Seoane will proceed from Manila to Dagupen and to such other points the Department Commander may direct. Travel directed necessary to the public service." It was that uninvolved, and we were to leave in a week or ten days.

Thompson got down to the arduous task of orienting me. He explained what was expected of us, what we would be doing, how we would be doing it, and the general situation as he knew it to exist. As the work was for the Army it fell to me to do all the writing of reports covering our activities.

"It works this way," he began. "There are serious dangers and complications involved. Maybe I over-emphasize that, but back in the United States, anyone has access to our sea coast. They're practically free to anyone who visits them, whether a foreigner or not. And, that includes our sea coast fortifications. It's not like that in Japan at all. Here, I'll show you."

Thompson dug into his pocket and pulled forth a battered map of Japan. He spread it out before us and poked with a pencil. "You see, here they have a circle drawn about a mile distant from this inland city. That's a 'Prohibited Zone.' Beyond this is another circle, a 'Restricted Zone.' That's essentially two miles from the city, and then three miles beyond the city is another area called a 'Warning Zone.' For any foreigner to pass beyond this three-mile warning zone, closer to the city, would be to cause trouble at once."

I was puzzled. "Fine, but they can't possibly work that on the sea coast towns."

He showed his pleasure for my catching that flaw. "Right, and that's where we'll operate. What we'll have to do is study navigation charts of any region we expect to visit."

I interrupted, "They'll give us a geographical familiarity with general land features, but fortifications won't show on navigation charts; just coastal features."

"Right," Thompson answered quickly, "and we'll have to study the region beforehand and go in well-prepared to recognize land details."

He went on to explain that Japan was a hilly country, and that these high land features would often assist us materially in the mastering of details in order to reach proper conclusions in our collection of espionage material. Also, if a fort were located on the edge of a city, it would be impractical for authorities to carry out their one, two and three-mile zoning provisions. It would be the most logical place for us to operate. This was particularly pertinent, since our espionage information, if it contained nothing else, should comprehensively outline Japan's coastal defenses.

We then outlined our strategy, basing it all on never to hurry during our mission. Our modus operandi would be to stay several weeks in the selected regions to give every impression that we were interested in nothing but collecting natural history specimens.

It was as simple as that. In a way, perhaps, we were to be trail blazers. The American Army had never undertaken to conduct—in any systematized manner—the procurement of foreign Intelligence. There were several countries abroad that made the collection and evaluation of espionage data a very extensive and preferred function of their governmental activities. In fact, Great Britain's head of the Intelligence Service was a Cabinet officer and the greatest emphasis was placed on the assimilation of foreign news items. Russia was another such country, and France was not far behind her. But, as of then, the United States had never established any well-conceived plan for such work.

Maybe, we thought, our actions will form the nucleus of a new, broad-thinking phase of our military preparedness in the Far East.

In anticipation of our journey, we selected names and backgrounds. My name was to be John G. Nurse, and Thompson's was Dr. Kuhne. Thompson decided it best for him to grow a beard, which being light in color, would give him the appearance of being a Boer. Though born on Long Island, New York, of American parents, for this mission he chose to represent himself as a native of South Africa. To strengthen this false background he declared himself to be the son of a Boer mother and an English father. The Boer War had ended some five years before, and Thompson said he has posed as an English colonel on certain occasions, using the Boer pretext to avoid discussions with English people about matters pertaining to the war. He found that pretending to have sympathies for both sides discouraged any prolonged discussion of a controversial issue that still had high feelings wherever Boers or English were.

From his appearance, Thompson could successfully bring off the ruse. And, to further assure me that we could conduct such complete subterfuge during our espionage activities in places other than Japan, which we would visit, he said, "Rest assured, we'll make it. We'll have to be very careful, and that will act in our favor. Over-confidence would be deadly to us, so as long as we have a healthy respect for our immediate danger, we'll be all right. I speak Japanese, and I know the people. We won't have any trouble."

I needed even more reassurance, perhaps, for I asked, "What happens if we run afoul of the police and really have a problem?"

"Well," he replied, honestly, "we'd have to handle it as best we can." Then sidestepping it, he added, "The Japanese employ two methods in dealing with suspicious persons. If the person in question lives in a large city, it's most likely he would be arrested and disposed of by court action imposing some sentence, depending upon the evidence. In an isolated place such as the various islands we'll be visiting, the police would have the power to dispose of such cases summarily. They simply report that you have been killed during the night by robbers who as yet have not been discovered. But, don't worry about it; we won't have any trouble."

He was saying not to worry too often, I thought, but his sincere, positive approach to it all was a tonic. I lost whatever apprehension I might have had and began looking forward to the job at hand.

"All right," I said challengingly, "I'm ready. When do we start?"

"The day after tomorrow, or as quickly as we can draw enough money from the Army to finance a journey of a year or two. We'll start our mission by taking passage from Manila to Hong Kong. It's a three-day trip, and we have a lot to talk over during the voyage. Meantime, I'd prefer it if you would call me by my nickname."

I was glad to know I had been accepted, and asked what it was.

"Snake," he replied. "Taken from my interest in snakes, and because I wear this."

He indicated a little gold snake ornament which was pinned to the folds of a kelly-green scarf he wore around his neck.
"I have an idea," he related, "as to how a snake might some day be able to save our lives if we get into a tight spot, Seoane, and it ties in with what you asked a while ago about what would we do if we have trouble."

He would not explain specifically what he meant, and the next day we bought passage on a passenger ship from Manila to Hong Kong. After bidding goodby to friends in the Philippines, "Snake" Thompson and I embarked on the first leg of our espionage mission that was to cover every major port and tive [sic] war with the huge country. She instantly embarked on island of the Far East.

The date was June, 1909.

Seoane, C. A. (1960). Beyond the Ranges. New York: Robert Speller & Sons, Publishers, Inc.
Seoane wrote several chapters on his espionage mission with Thompson, which took place between 1909-1911.
INTELLIGENCE SPECIALIST TRAINING ROUTINE – TR L
Purpose: To train the student to give a false statement with good TR-1. To train the student to outflow false data effectively.
Commands: Part l “Tell me a lie”.

peter
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Re: Snake Thompson

Post by peter » Thu Oct 28, 2010 12:38 pm

The Early history of Psychoanalysis in San Francisco by Daniel Benveniste, Caracas, Venezuela.
Around 1924, Thompson was on board a US Navy transport, passing through the Panama Canal when he met a woman and her charming 12-year-old son on their way to Washington DC to join their husband and father, Harold ‘Hub’ Ross Hubbard. Hub was in the Navy and a friend of Thompson’s. Thompson didn’t have children of his own and found the boy bright and delightful company. On the boat, and continuing in Washington DC, Thompson established a mentoring relationship to the boy. He taught him how to train cats, got him into reading books at the Library of Congress, and introduced him to psychoanalysis and Otto Rank’s theory of the birth trauma. The boy took all this in and it had an important influence on his later work. The boy’s name was Lafayette Ronald Hubbard better known as L. Ron Hubbard, the science fiction writer and founder of the Church of Scientology and the science of Dianetics (Warner 1992). It has been said that L. Ron Hubbard absconded with many of Thompson’s tales and re-told them as his own experiences.
http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/s ... l=sv&gl=se

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Uttermost East and the Longest War. By Seoane, Rhoda Low.
Rhoda Seoane has woven through this book a most graphic account, dealing with the Boxer Uprising, Putnam Weale, her late husband, Colonel Seoane, and his friends, Commander Joseph ["Snake"] Thompson and Brigadier-General Henry J. Reilly, active in the U.S. Naval and Military Services,
http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=ntt_athr_dp ... 9%20Seoane

Chapter 6 Spying In Japan
Page 94: There was that day in Washington when “Snake” Thompson that unusual and astute personality, stood before Seoane once again. “Seoane” he began in his customary direct manner. “I am scheduled to give a talk to a group of medical officers at the naval hospital close by on the subject of psychiatry, which I have been following at St. Elizabeth’s. Won’t you come over and join the group at three a clock tomorrow?” Seoane accepted with pleasure and said he would be there. The next day Seoane was among the group of medical officers present, and admired both Thompson’s fluency of speech and his manner of presenting the subject without notes. After their lecture was concluded, Seoane joined him and they talked about their former work in Japan.

Page 97: The Colonel’s dark eyes glowed with interest as he continued to recount how “snake” – as he liked to be called – because of his interest in snakes and coleoptera, or hard-shelled beetles, never spoke to a superior in rank as a subordinate, for he always felt himself the other’s mental match. For alertness of mind and quickness in action, there were few his equal and none his superior.“ One day in Formosa I said to him, ‘Snake, what would you do if a card player confronted you with a pistol?’” “ ‘I would have it out of his grasp before he realized what was happening,’ was his quick answer.

“Thompson never consumed any alcohol, neither did he smoke. His knowledge of whatever subject he might be interested in was so detailed and his mind as sharp as a razor’s edge, he would have been a most able cross-examiner in court. I formed this opinion during our five hundred-mile trek together.”

Page 98. Snake knew that he had been selected for a task, which none other had been able to qualify for, and he was fluent in Japanese, he wanted to apply full use of his wits to his country’s service. He selected Seoane as his essential companion because of his understanding of topography and a general military knowledge. One day they received a courtesy call from a Japanese natural history professor. Thompson showed the professor’s card to Consuelo and said with grimace that our new caller has undoubtedly been sent by the police to inquire into our knowledge of natural history. “I will dispatch him, giving him an inferiority complex regarding his particular profession”. After this all such visits terminated.

Page 99: “Snake” do you remember the time you were at sea when you placed a crawling snake in a bathtub, making a humorous story for the chip’s officer”? Page 100: “his reply was merely the familiar twisted smile I know so well”. Consuelo Seoane’ s features relaxed and his lips parted, forming that brilliant smile, once seen never forgotten.

Commander Joseph Thompson had spent a tour of two years in the naval Hospital at Yokohama, refreshing his knowledge of Japanese, which he has learned as a boy in Japan, where his father had been a missionary. Later he was detached from Yokohama to become part of the American Naval contingent engaged in the Boxer Uprising.

Page 101: “Thompson had an unusual temperament, I learned subsequently that when in Washington he would go to the Congressional Library for diversion, in order to read Sanskrit, an Indo-European language.”¨

Soderqvist1: Joe Tom Sun from Guam is Thompson’s Penname. There is photography on Commander Thompson on page 113. There he is unearthing skeletal remains of a prehistoric race on Island of Guam 1922. It belong to Consuelo Seoane, it is a memento he retained of his staunch friendship. Consuelo are saying about Thompson there that; “He had fundamental a kind nature”

Bernice P. Bishop Museum Bulletin 4 By Herbert E. Gregory Honolulu Hawaii 1922
Through the generosity of Commander J. C. Thompson, of the United States Naval Hospital, Lt. H. G. Hornbostel of the Museum staff was given the opportunity to undertake a systematic exploration of Guam, with a view to obtaining information regarding an ancient people whose position in the group of Pacific races remains to be determined.
http://www.archive.org/stream/bulletin0 ... 1/mode/2up

Rhoda Low Seoane Page 117: Snake 1922, on the Island of Guam, dug up one of the tombs of a previous people, whishing to determine what the anatomy showed. On that island are a number of gravestones marking the burial spot of previous people. The present-day inhabitants of this Island know absolute nothing as to who these prior inhabitants were, or in what period they lived there. Nevertheless, these marking stones are regarded with veneration and consequently, no one is allowed to molest them. The inhabitant became so aroused by Thompson’s unusual act that the Governor of Guam transmitted their complaints to Washington.” At this juncture the colonel paused, then said with a slight smile, “Soon afterward Thompson found himself in Hawaii .” A sudden breeze blew across the porch as a ripple of laughter floated the air.

Lecture: Mechanics of the Mind By L. Ron Hubbard
It's very odd to realize, as I did one day, that in subsequent years I have approximated to a very remarkable degree the career of Commander Thompson - to show you what an impressed - impressionable boy can have handed to him suddenly. I have followed that, however, fragmentarily. It just sort of dubs in to the career that I have been following to this degree that - I didn't realize this until one day I looked at a map, and in the field of expeditions, explorations, I always favored certain quarters of the world, always went there and, when there, did certain things. It fits Commander Thompson's record. Amusing.

It just suddenly struck me one day, I hadn't ever realized it. Nothing would do at a certain place I went but what I would dig up one of the old, ancient tribal burial grounds. Never realized the significance of this until one day - I hadn't known this, you see - I was standing in the Bishop Museum in Hawaii and saw there the exhibit of Commander Thompson on some of the men he had dug up in a tribal burying grounds. All right. He directed my attention toward many things and perhaps imparted to me, fragmentarily or otherwise, the basic tenets of Sigmund Freud
http://carolineletkeman.org/sp/index.ph ... Itemid=240

2 The Cultural Context of Scientology by William Sims Bainbridge
Page 39: Snake Thompson was the best friend of my great uncle, (Consuelo Seoane). Together, around 1911, they spent nearly two years as American spies inside the Japanese Empire, charting possible invasion routes and counting all the Japanese fortifications and naval guns. Page 41: I have told this true story at some length, both because Thompson was so influential in Mr. Hubbard’s intellectual development, and because it illustrates a little appreciated fact. A very few adventuresome souls really do have the fantastic experience described in science fiction or action-adventure stories.

Page 42: Mr. Hubbard’s personal interest in the sea, in wild adventures in exotic lands, and in combining science with spiritual questing may in some significant measure have been inspired by Snake Thompson.
http://books.google.se/books?id=MtW90Yk ... 3#PPA39,M1

Wikipedia William Sims Bainbridge
Born October 12, 1940) is an American sociologist who currently resides in Virginia. He is co-director of Human-Centered Computing at the National Science Foundation (NSF) and also teaches sociology as a part-time professor at George Mason University. He is the first Senior Fellow to be appointed by the Institute for Ethics and Emerging Technologies. Bainbridge is most well known for his work on the sociology of religion; recently, however, he has published work studying the sociology of video gaming.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Sims_Bainbridge

Soderqvist1: William Sims Bainbridge in the above link recounting the espionage tour by “snake” and Seoane Page 40: “Both Con and snake understood how dangerous the mission would be, but the doctor had the advantage of a good cover story for his travels. He would pretend to be a South African naturalist named Victor Kuhne, tramping the shores of the Pacific in search of scientific specimens. page 41; Thompson had in fact assembled 11,787 specimens of reptiles, amphibian , and insects, which he gave to the museum of the California Academy of Science, half under his own name and half under his guise as Victor Khune.”

CHICAGO NATURAL HISTORY MUSEUM DECEMBER 8, 1947
Page 298 The notable exception was the large collection made for the California Academy of Sciences by Victor Kuhn in 1910. Page 322: Type from Naze, Amami. No. 23852 California Academy of Sciences. Adult male. Collected by Mr. Victor Kuhne, April 26 to May 1, 1910.
http://www.archive.org/stream/prelimina ... e_djvu.txt
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J. Swift
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Re: Snake Thompson

Post by J. Swift » Thu Oct 28, 2010 3:45 pm

Joseph Cheesman Thompson (1874–1943) bears a striking resemblance to Captain Bill Robertson.

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On another matter, is there any actual evidence that Thompson ever personally met Freud, let alone studied with him? Freud's only visit to America occurred in 1909: http://chronicle.com/article/Freuds-Vis ... k-U/48424/

Freud gave five lectures in German at a small college. Thompson was presumably absent, he being in Japan, Hawaii, or the Philippines during this period. Thompson also did not speak German.

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Re: Snake Thompson

Post by peter » Fri Oct 29, 2010 7:51 am

Soderqvist1: As far to my knowledge L. Ron Hubbard’s claim that Commander “Snake” Thompson has study for Sigmund Freud in Vienna, and was just on is way home when he met him on the ship 1923 is not truth. But they were in touch with each other by letter correspondence in German. Thompson was trained by Philip S. Graven at St. Elizabeth in Washington DC.

Sigmund Freud in the Library of Congress
Correspondence with Sigmund Freud, 1876-1974 Box 42 Sun, Joe Tom (pseudonym of a Dr. Thompson, Baltimore, M d.), 1923 Thompson, Dr. [?] See same container, Sun, Joe Tom
http://lcweb2.loc.gov/service/mss/eadxm ... 004017.pdf

Transcripts From The Gerry Armstrong Case Page 4342 – 4345
Q And were you able to find anything that showed that this individual, Joseph Chessman Thompson, had had any connection with Sigmund Freud?

A Yes, we did.
This is obtained from the private papers of Sigmund Freud in Washington, D.C. This is a post card, which was sent to Commander Thompson. It is in German and somebody else can do the translation. It is basically, “Thanks for the photographs and do keep in touch.” We got it from the Library of Congress. This is correlated also by his stepdaughter who I have spoken with, Mr. Thompson’s stepdaughter.
http://www.gerryarmstrong.org/50k/legal/a1/1627.php

A sculptor's odyssey: oral history by Jacques Schnier
Page 117: Riess: You're saying he was one of the few, or the only analyst?

Schnier: He was the first, the first real psychoanalyst in San Francisco. He had been trained at St. Elizabeth's Hospital, which already was becoming psychoanalytically oriented.

Riess: And who was he trained by?

Schnier: He was trained by a man named Gravens. In those days it was not a very deep analysis. He was an M.D. , by the way.

Riess: So he wasn't identified as a Freudian?

Schnier: Oh, yes, he was a Freudian. Of all the material that he had studied and he had been exposed to, he found that the Freudian material was the stuff that he accepted before all others.

Riess: Did he go abroad to have an analysis?

Schnier: Oh, no.

Riess: Nothing like that.

Page 169: Schnier: Does the name Gravens ring a bell? Gravens was Thompson's analyst, and I wondered if Thompson had recommended Gravens to Kroeber, or if Kroeber found out about him on his own, or whether Thompson was influenced by Kroeber being analyzed. I have it in the literature. I'll look it up.
http://www.archive.org/stream/sculptoro ... 9/mode/2up

The Psychoanalytic Review (1925). 12:244-248
The Washington Psychoanalytic Association, Washington, D. C., was organized April 11, 1924, for the purpose of furthering and disseminating knowledge relative to psychoanalysis. The membership is restricted to physicians who, in order to be admitted, must present a thesis containing the history of one case, successfully analyzed by the applicant. Another requirement is that, before an applicant may be considered for admittance, he must present evidence of having been successfully analyzed by a competent psychoanalyst. The present officers of the association are: Wm. A. White, M.D., President; Joseph C. Thompson, M.D., Vice-President; Lucille Dooley, M.D., Secretary and Treasurer. The other charter members are Philip S. Graven, M.D. , Louis D. Hubbard, M.D., and Benjamin Karpman, M.D.

The following papers have so far been presented: An Analysis of a Case of Vampirism, by Philip S. Graven, M.D.; Freudian Mechanisms, by Joseph C. Thompson, M.D.; The Psychopathology of Exhibitionism, with report of a case, by Ben Karpman, M.D.; A Case of Obsession with Phobias, by Lucille Dooley, M.D.; Rank's Modification of the Psychoanalytic Technic, by William A. White, M.D.
http://www.pep-web.org/document.php?id=psar.012.0244a

Science sand Sanity Review by DOCTOR PHILIP S. GRAVEN, Psychiatrist, Washington, D. C. 1933
"I have read Science and Sanity through completely, some parts several times, and I must admit I have never encountered a work so rich in fundamental suggestions. It clearly covers a field almost wholly neglected in our University education. From the methodological point of view, therefore, the book is indispensable to any one endeavoring to carry on sane, clear, scientific work. This of course includes Medicine and especially Medical Psychology where sane thinking about the un-sane and 'insane' is vital at all times. Statements, principles, etc., that affect one's mental attitude toward problems are of most importance. These, Science and Sanity provides in abundance.

In addition to the scientists being considerably aided by the use of the non-aristotelian principles (aided in carrying on sane, creative, well-tempered, rigorous thinking about their observations and experimental data), there is also another group directly affected: namely, the mentally disordered. By direct clinical application, I have found the non-aristotelian principles workable in this enormous group. My observations cover a period of about six years. I shall have a great deal to say about these observations in contributions to medical and scientific journals. By reading the book carefully, I have derived many benefits: personal, cultural, professional, scientific. The book appeals to me as one that will supply at least a few generations of scientific workers with a means of maintaining a productive, not clogging and obstructive psycho-logical attitude towards investigations needful to human security and advancement. And what could be more urgent in this modern age than a means to attain and maintain sanity: Korzybski's Theory of Sanity already makes that a possibility."
http://www.rodsmith.org.uk/alfred-korzy ... 200989.htm

Science and Sanity by Alfred Korzybski
Page 185: These theoretical conclusions have been fully justified by experience and the work of Doctor Philip S. Graven in psychotherapy. It should be noticed that different primitive 'magic of words', or modern 'hypostatizations', 'reifications', 'misplaced concrete-ness', 'objectincations'., and all semantic disturbances represent nothing else but a confusion of orders of abstractions, or identifications in value of essentially different orders of abstractions.
http://www.rodsmith.org.uk/alfred-korzy ... 200385.htm

Page: 397: In the experiments of Doctor Philip S. Graven with the 'mentally' ill, training in the realization of this stratification has either resulted in complete recovery or has markedly improved the conditions of the patient.
http://www.rodsmith.org.uk/alfred-korzy ... 200597.htm
Last edited by peter on Fri Oct 29, 2010 9:22 am, edited 2 times in total.
A simple explanation with few explanation grounds is to prefer, except when you need to hide your flaws! - Peter Soderqvist

peter
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Re: Snake Thompson

Post by peter » Fri Oct 29, 2010 8:51 am

Soderqvist1: for the sake of clarity, Commander Thompson seems to have met the Little Hubbard onboard the Ship, he just happen to be there as he lived in San Diego, and recognized his mother as his Colleague Ross Hubbard’s wife. There is an amusing story how Commander Thompson got his nickname “Snake”!

Rhoda Low Seoane Chapter 8 Talks with Bertram Simpson
Page 123: On the 15t November 1900, Commander Joseph Thompson, attached to the United States Naval Force in Peking, who had just walked through remains of the Fu, approached the home of Bertram Lenox Simpson, whom he had met during the siege proper.

126: Bertram Lenox Simpson stretching out his hand, said; “Come in Thompson, and sit down.”

Page 132: “By the way Thompson, though this is a personal matter, I hope you will excuse what may seem to be perhaps too familiar. I have been interested in you unusual scarf pin – a small gold snake” His voice rose in a questioning tone. Thompson stated that he had long been interested in the study of snakes and Coleoptera, or hard-shelled beetles. In the Navy and behind his back, the men called him “Snake”. Once he had placed a snake in the bathtub. He was ordered to the naval Station at Key West in Florida, where there was but a small detachment of the Marine Corps and Naval Force, with no large hospital within easy reach. It might be presumed that any ability, which he might have had, would become rusty in such a remote spot. After he had been there for ten months he wrote to the authorities that he had found that station a most excellent place for the study of ichthyology, as the nearby waters abounded in all types of marine life. He therefore, requested that his station be extended for another year. It was more than likely that his letter irritated the personnel in the Bureau at Washington, for he was quickly transferred to another post. When the time arrived for his examination, however he was duly passed and promoted.

Bertram Simpson smiled and asked in a rising voice: “I suppose you had your medical training in the States,” and continuing, he inquired, “and how do you happen to speak Japanese so Fluently?” “I spent some time in Japan.”
Darwin’s Origin of Species was Thompson’s favourite reading matter. He never drank or smoked, but his poker winnings gave him annually three thousand dollars a year. He always had the book with him and it was among his belongings in Peking. Simpson said quickly that he realized from the moment he has met Thompson that he had and exceedingly keen intellect. Thompson thanked him, and stating he was a graduate of the Colombia Medical School.

A tabulation of 17 items of books, and papers etc, by Joseph Thompson
http://www.google.se/search?hl=sv&tbo=1 ... =&gs_rfai=
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caroline
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Re: Snake Thompson

Post by caroline » Fri Oct 29, 2010 7:53 pm

Wow, some excellent additions, Soderqvist1!

Here's a better link to Daniel Benveniste's A Brief History of Psychoanalysis on the West Coast of the United States, published in INTERNATIONAL PSYCHOANALYSIS VOLUME 3. ISSUE 2 1994. (pdf)

And here's A sculptor's Odessey by Jacques Schnier. (pdf)
INTELLIGENCE SPECIALIST TRAINING ROUTINE – TR L
Purpose: To train the student to give a false statement with good TR-1. To train the student to outflow false data effectively.
Commands: Part l “Tell me a lie”.

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Re: Snake Thompson

Post by MitsuToo » Fri Oct 29, 2010 9:29 pm

This is really interesting stuff and forgive me if I'm repeating what is maybe already common knowledge around here but does this mean that this is the source of Hubbard's psychoanalysis influence for Dianetics? Was Thompson then a psychiatrist? Sounds like Hubbard "borrowed" Snake Thompson's adventures for his own as well which explains a lot. Sounding more and more like he lived more in his imagination than he ever did in real life. I sure hope Gerry publishes Hubbard's biography one day...the real one...not the pretend one.

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Re: Snake Thompson

Post by caroline » Fri Oct 29, 2010 10:22 pm

MitsuToo wrote:This is really interesting stuff and forgive me if I'm repeating what is maybe already common knowledge around here but does this mean that this is the source of Hubbard's psychoanalysis influence for Dianetics? Was Thompson then a psychiatrist? Sounds like Hubbard "borrowed" Snake Thompson's adventures for his own as well which explains a lot. Sounding more and more like he lived more in his imagination than he ever did in real life. I sure hope Gerry publishes Hubbard's biography one day...the real one...not the pretend one.
Hi MitsuToo,
Hubbard claimed that his "basic, if unappreciated, education in the field of the mind came from Commander Thompson of the Medical Corps of the US Navy." (Hubbard, L. R. (1956, 10 July). A Critic of Psychoanalysis The Technical Bulletins of Dianetics and Scientology (1991 ed., Vol. 3, pp. 443-449). Los Angeles: Bridge Publications, Inc.)

There is actually quite a bit of evidence to assemble a picture of a meaningful relationship between Thompson and Hubbard. Snake Thompson is clearly the most viable unsub for Hubbard's basic and unappreciated, to say nothing of glib and falsified, education.

Actually the question is when am I going to publish Gerry's biography? Since he can't speak a word. :)
INTELLIGENCE SPECIALIST TRAINING ROUTINE – TR L
Purpose: To train the student to give a false statement with good TR-1. To train the student to outflow false data effectively.
Commands: Part l “Tell me a lie”.

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Re: Snake Thompson

Post by caroline » Sat Oct 30, 2010 7:35 pm

According to Jacques Schnier, above, Philip S. Graven analyzed Snake Thompson. Alfred Korzybski acknowledged Dr. Graven in Science and Sanity: An Introduction to Non-Aristotelian Systems and General Semantics:
Alfred Korzybski wrote:c
PREFACE TO THE FIRST EDITION
I wish to express my deep appreciation to Doctor W. A. White and the staff of St. Elizabeth's Hospital, Washington, D. C, who, during my two years of study in the hospital, gave me every assistance to facilitate my research work there. I am indebted to Doctor P. S. Graven for supplying me with his as yet unpublished experimental clinical material, which was very useful to me.

Three important terms have been suggested to me; namely, 'envirogenetic' by Doctor C. B. Bridges, 'actional' by Professor P. W. Bridgman, and 'un-sane' by Doctor P. S. Graven, which debt I gladly acknowledge.

[...]

A. K.
New York, August, 1933.


Korzybski, A. (2000). Science and Sanity: An Introduction to Non-Aristotelian Systems and General Semantics. Brooklyn, NY: Institute of General Semantics.
--
Edit: citation
Last edited by caroline on Sun Oct 31, 2010 2:05 am, edited 1 time in total.
INTELLIGENCE SPECIALIST TRAINING ROUTINE – TR L
Purpose: To train the student to give a false statement with good TR-1. To train the student to outflow false data effectively.
Commands: Part l “Tell me a lie”.

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Re: Snake Thompson

Post by caroline » Sat Oct 30, 2010 8:06 pm

Hubbard talked about Korzybski and his failed educational therapy:
L. Ron Hubbard wrote:Here’s a whole matter of definition. Definition is taken up so beautifully and expertly by Count Alfred Korzybski that it is very difficult to improve in any way upon his classifications of definitions or his understanding of definitions.

Somebody said it a little shorter than Korzybski, uh… Voltaire – if you would argue with me, define your terms, and uh… Korzybski is speaking in the main about this universe, he’s using that reference point, and he is in the main working in an effort to gain a therapy which he never gains. The therapy intended in General Semantics, it would be the therapy resulting from any education, but an enforced discipline of forcing people to stop and think for a moment about this and that just to communicate better, puts a stop on the line. So it isn’t a therapy; it’s educational in its therapy level. It is not a process or a therapy which they tried to make of it and which it failed on.

But it was too bad that they did that because it is what it is… it’s uh… a dissertation and a very wonderful piece of work on the subject of definition. But we put down here… this is not particularly an agreement or disagreement with that. I don’t think Korzybski himself would disagree with these. He might even have a little fun with them.

Hubbard, L. R. (1952, 4 December). The Logics and Methods of Thinking. Philadelphia Doctorate Course, (PDC-14). Lecture conducted from Philadelphia, PA.
Cf. Hubbard's description of educational therapy with Schnier's description of his analysis with Snake Thompson in A sculptor's odessey.
INTELLIGENCE SPECIALIST TRAINING ROUTINE – TR L
Purpose: To train the student to give a false statement with good TR-1. To train the student to outflow false data effectively.
Commands: Part l “Tell me a lie”.

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Re: Snake Thompson

Post by J. Swift » Sun Oct 31, 2010 1:28 am

Cf. Hubbard's description of educational therapy with Schnier's description of his analysis with Snake Thompson in A sculptor's odessey.
Caroline, that is extremely illuminating reading. It is very easy to infer that LRH borrowed his model directly from Snake Thompson: Dianetics and Scientology is a form of Freudian lay counseling but with this important difference: Dianetics and Scientology have no malpractice insurance because they are "religious" in nature. Schnier states a few times that he did not become a lay therapist as he was unable to obtain malpractice insurance due to the fact that he was not an M.D. and therefore not insurable as a lay therapist. Virtually all Freudian psychoanalysts were M.D.'s -- as are all psychiatrists.

Scientology gets away with an amazing amount of criminality and abuse in the US because it has its scandalous religious status. Scientology is a religion in the same way that spent uranium is a breakfast cereal. Scientology is the only religion that has a high school drop out as its Pope. This does not say much for CoS that a drop out with rage disorder is considered to be the top Scientologist in the world.

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Re: Snake Thompson

Post by caroline » Sun Oct 31, 2010 5:31 pm

Journal of the American Medical Association 16 March 1918 wrote:surgeons to be medical inspectors with the rank of commander: Joseph C. Thompson

JAMA, (1918, 16 March) Navy Medical Notes. Journal of the American Medical Association, 93 (18), 785. Retrieved 30 October 2010 from http://jama.ama-assn.org/cgi/reprint/70/11/784.
Journal of the American Medical Association 14 September 1929 wrote:Comdr. Joseph C. Thompson, relieved of all duty and ordered home on furlough;

JAMA, (1929, 14 September) Government Services, Navy Personals. Journal of the American Medical Association, 856, 93 (11), 856. Retrieved 30 October 2010 from http://jama.ama-assn.org/cgi/reprint/93/11/856.
Journal of the American Medical Association 2 November 1929 wrote:Cmdr. Joseph C. Thompson has been relieved from all active duty and ordered home;

JAMA, (1929, 2 November) Government Services, Navy Personals. Journal of the American Medical Association, 93 (18), 1394. Retrieved 30 October 2010 from http://jama.ama-assn.org/cgi/reprint/93/18/1394.
INTELLIGENCE SPECIALIST TRAINING ROUTINE – TR L
Purpose: To train the student to give a false statement with good TR-1. To train the student to outflow false data effectively.
Commands: Part l “Tell me a lie”.

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Re: Snake Thompson

Post by caroline » Mon Nov 01, 2010 12:08 am

I'm expanding one of Soderqvist1's quotes from Science and Sanity:
Alfred Korzysbski wrote:The above considerations of order lead to a formulation of a fundamental principle (a principle underlying the whole of the non-aristotelian system); namely, that organisms which represent processes must develop in a certain natural survival four-dimensional order, and that the reversal of that order must lead to pathological (non-survival) developments. Observations disclose that, in all human difficulties, 'mental' ills included, a reversal of the natural order can be found as a matter of fact, once we decide to consider order as fundamental. Any identification of inherently different levels, or confusion of orders of abstractions, leads automatically to the reversal of natural order. As a method of preventive education and psychotherapy, whenever we succeed in reversing the reversed order or restoring the natural survival order, serious beneficial results are to be expected. These theoretical conclusions have been fully justified by experience and the work of Doctor Philip S. Graven in psychotherapy. It should be noticed that different primitive 'magic of words', or modern 'hypostatizations', 'reifications', 'misplaced concrete-ness', 'objectincations'., and all semantic disturbances represent nothing else but a confusion of orders of abstractions, or identifications in value of essentially different orders of abstractions.

The above considerations are entirely general, but, because of their novelty, they have not, as yet, been applied in the non-aristotelian simple and workable form to psychiatry or education. In a very instructive paper on The Language of Schizophrenia," Doctor William A. White* applies some of these notions. Because of the method of approach, I will quote from this paper. It should be understood that this paper deals, also, with other issues, and the quotations do not do justice to the author, because I quote only those passages which are of particular interest here, omitting the literature given by Doctor White. The italics and one footnote are mine.

'It requires but a moment's serious consideration to realize that the subject of schizophrenic language must be immense if for no other reason than that it involves an understanding of the whole subject of language of which it is but a part. The extent and depth of the subject of language may be further appreciated from the fact that the single feature of its neuronic background as it is brought to attention in aphasia constitutes one of the most complex problems in the whole field of neurology and one with respect to which we are still hopelessly ignorant, especially when the enormous amount of work that has been done in this field is considered. . . .

'There have been a few other recent contributions to the subject of schizophrenic thought and speech which, as they run more in line with my own thinking on the subject, I will refer to more fully. These studies equate the processes of thinking of schisophrenic persons with those of primitive peoples and of children.

'. . . In the archaic thinking of a prelogical kind, found among primitive savage races, the vividness of the images is greater than among more highly developed races, and the effect produced in the observer is projected and believed to be an inherent attitude of the object, which thus acquires a "demonic" character. All things which arouse a similar emotion are thought of as being actually the same. In dementia praecox there is a similar loss of objectivity; hallucinations and reality are imperfectly distinguished, and every happening has a meaning and effect on the observer; the idea of an action produces the action directly, instead of offering a possibility of action, and this is interpreted as a compulsion from without. Paralogical thinking is a stage beyond this; identification of objects is based on similarities, differences being neglected. . . . This form of thought is common in dementia praecox.

Korzybski, A. (2000). Science and Sanity: An Introduction to Non-Aristotelian Systems and General Semantics. Brooklyn, NY: Institute of General Semantics.
* More on William Alanson White and Snake Thompson

Cf. Hubbard's "therapeutic" approach to schizophrenia:
L. Ron Hubbard wrote:TO SPLIT VALENCES [Definition: valence]

A term that really makes a psychiatrist feel like somebody is “schizo,” their nickname for the schizophrenic. It is an odd misnomer in that it means split personality and the trouble with a schizo is that he needs splitting, not that he’s split. He’s in another’s valence, and what is required is to remove or split the preclear out of that other’s valence.*

Hubbard, L. R. (1957, 15 February). Good Processes The Technical Bulletins of Dianetics and Scientology (1991 ed., Vol. IV, pp. 16-20). Los Angeles: Bridge Publications, Inc.
* The NOTs process, at OT 5 and above, addresses the valence problems of body thetans. I.e., pre-OTs telepathically get their BTs to answer the auditing questions "What are you?" and "Who are you?" When the BTs being processed realize that they are actually themselves ("I'm me!"), they supposedly blow off.

Cf. also, the ethics condition "Enemy" and its formula: "FIND OUT WHO YOU REALLY ARE." (Ref. Introduction to Scientology Ethics.)
INTELLIGENCE SPECIALIST TRAINING ROUTINE – TR L
Purpose: To train the student to give a false statement with good TR-1. To train the student to outflow false data effectively.
Commands: Part l “Tell me a lie”.

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Re: Snake Thompson

Post by peter » Mon Nov 01, 2010 10:47 am

Soderqvist1: some (many) critics has claim that Hubbard was a conman with intent!
That is not right, because the evidence indicate that he suffered from paranoid schizophrenia!

Hubbard: A term that really makes a psychiatrist feel like somebody is “schizo,” their nickname for the schizophrenic. It is an odd misnomer in that it means split personality and the trouble with a schizo is that he needs splitting, not that he’s split. He’s in another’s valence, and what is required is to remove or split the preclear out of that other’s valence.*

Wikipedia Schizophrenia
schizophrenia does not imply a "split mind" and it is not the same as dissociative identity disorder—also known as "multiple personality disorder" or "split personality"—a condition with which it is often confused in public perception.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schizophrenia

Soderqvist1: Science and Sanity is talking about how the observer has his abstracting process reversed or confused and the outside world is confused with the inner world. It doesn’t say anything about that the observer is mixed up with other identities. The book claim that “the object acquire demonic character”, it is a distortion in the “thought process”, not that this entity is mixed up with the observer, in example the primitive see the Sun, and believes it is a God!

Wikipedia: Schizophrenia is a mental disorder characterized by a disintegration of the process of thinking and of emotional responsiveness. It most commonly manifests as auditory hallucinations, paranoid or bizarre delusions, or disorganized speech and thinking, and it is accompanied by significant social or occupational dysfunction. The onset of symptoms typically occurs in young adulthood, with a global lifetime prevalence of around 1.5%. Diagnosis is based on the patient's self-reported experiences and observed behaviour.

A Piece of Blue Sky Hubbard in the East
There are two accounts of this trip in the same notebook. Although they are within a few pages of one another, they differ in detail. Ron was already making a habit of elaborating his past, and the accounts teach us to question the veracity of any Hubbard claim. The Henderson's passenger list shows that rather than having been allowed aboard only an hour before, Ron was aboard fully 24 hours before she sailed. On Guam, the seventeen-year-old Ron was tutored by his mother, a qualified teacher, for what should have been his twelfth or senior high school grade. He was being prepared for the Naval Academy examination.
http://www.clambake.org/archive/books/apobs/bs2-2.htm

Soderqvist1: here is the evidence that what he has experienced has little later mutated to a different story, all in his own mind, a somewhat a bizarre delusion, as an indication what will come later!

Soderqvist1: this is a reply by me at Isene Forum

Valkov: Explain this away, Peter:

Soderqvist1: I don't need to explain away anything because what you say doesn't hold water!

Valkov: On July 18, 1966, L. Ron Hubbard gave a lecture called "About Rhodesia." He had just come back from a trip to the country now called Zimbabwe and discovered that a bunch of people had been "declared suppressive" by executives of Scientology headquarters at Saint Hill Manor in England. Staff were assembled so he could correct them on this and other points.

Soderqvist1: Who was these people, and what was wrong with the SP Declarers?

Valkov: In the lecture, LRH said, "But you don't have somebody that's been around three years and [...] turn up suddenly to be an SP."

Soderqvist1: I agree!

Valkov: "In all the time we've been around here we've only had one SP that I know of... Now whether he was an SP or PTS I've not made up my mind to this date because I haven't investigated the case enough."[So, in 6 to 7 years of operation, Hubbard had only found one SP candidate.]
L. Ron Hubbard, LRH Recorded Lecture "About Rhodesia," July 18, 1966

Soderqvist1: L. Ron Hubbard suffered from paranoid Schizophrenia!
He wrote 16 September 1965 the subject; Amprinistics; "Over the past 15 years we have seen a lot of groups splinter off from Scientology and beat the drum for some off beat use of the technology. We call them "squirrels" because they are so nutty. They come and they go. We're still here and will continue to be."

"Treatment -- They are each fair game, can be sued or harassed."

"The names of any persons attending should be collected and they should be labelled SP as they have left Scientology. These people are SP because they are seeking to avoid auditing and retain their withholds. Once labelled, these persons will not then be covered by amnesty and will never be admitted to further training or processing.

"Harass these persons in any possible way. "
http://suppressiveperson.org/spdl/index ... &Itemid=30

Soderqvist1: it is unnecessary to quote more, when you can read it for yourself!
Furthermore; Cyril Vosper was a Scientologist for 14 years and yet declared SP 1969. If L. Ron Hubbard was of Sound mind, and did know that "But you don't have somebody that's been around three years and [...] turn up suddenly to be an SP."
Why is Hubbard Plaintiff here?

Court of Appeal Civil Division Hubbard Vs Vosper 1971
http://www.clambake.org/archive/audit/vosper.html

Soderqvist1: Such "inconsistencies" has been consistent throughout L. Ron Hubbard's Life. He begged the Veteran Administration 1947 to get psychiatric treatment because he was suicidal, and Senior Psychiatrist Ulf Brettstam analysed papers at the time, from court records and come to such a conclusion that he is suicidal because he suffer from Paranoid Schizophrenia, and Hubbard's affirmations is only a temporary solution!
http://www.scnforum.org/index.php?t=msg ... #msg_12265

Soderqvist1: it seems that his prediction was correct, because he was happy married with Sara Northrop five years, then all of a sudden she turned into a Russian Spy Komkosadamanov, and then a little later a nazi spy together with Hollister using the divorce case to seize control of Dianetics. Read the details!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sara_Northrup_Hollister

Soderqvist1: Even John Mac Master, and Otto Roos, David Mayo, his closets confidantes at the time turned into "monsters". This is said by Otto Roos in a letter to Jon Attack;

As this is also a kind of "Debrief", and as I (like anybody who was Close to LRH and subsequently left) was badly third partied and slandered, this data may also be used to inform planet Earth that O. J. Roos was not quite as bad as he has been made out to be, and that he also was one of the major contributors to the TECHNOLOGIES and TECHNICAL POLICIES of Scn/Dn.
http://www.cs.cmu.edu/~dst/Library/Shelf/roos/

Affidavit of Andre Tabayoyon (5 March 1994)
38. I was advised by Richard Aznaran, Sinar Parman and Annie Breeder that Hubbard was an unhandled PTS III when he died. According to Sinar Parman, Hubbard was a psychopathic insane person screaming about BT's and clusters at the top of his lungs.
http://www.xenu-directory.net/documents ... 40305.html

Vistaril is a ‘psych drug’? by Senior Psychiatrist Ulf Brettstam
Hydroxyzine [Atarax] is still used in psychiatry today, despite the fact that we have a whole lot of new and more specified pharmacological substances then collegues had back in 1957 when this drug was approved by the FDA.
http://www.xenu.net/archive/free_speech ... taril.html
A simple explanation with few explanation grounds is to prefer, except when you need to hide your flaws! - Peter Soderqvist

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Re: Snake Thompson

Post by peter » Mon Nov 01, 2010 12:26 pm

Soderqvist1: more about it in this thread!

"The Lie" - DM is THE Correct Source of CofS Abuse
http://www.scnforum.org/index.php?t=msg ... 9c6c0957ab
A simple explanation with few explanation grounds is to prefer, except when you need to hide your flaws! - Peter Soderqvist

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