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 Post subject: OTIII The WALL OF FIRE hubbard stole THAT 'bright' idea &
PostPosted: Fri Jan 19, 2007 3:46 pm 
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In the ongoing research to document all the sources
Scientology's founder L Ron Hubbard stole his key
ideas (that scientologists thing are cool) much has
been discovered lately..

Study Tech - from a 19th century schoolteacher in Richmond Virginia
http://www.lermanet.com/exit/studytech/

Dianetics - from discarded psychiatric techniques called
abnormal reaction therapy -
http://www.lermanet.com/reference/whyworse.htm

Purification Rundown - dangerous application of mega vitamins
combined with the American Indian Sweat Lodge...

Scientology - The word is from a book from 1904 or so,
and originally was coined as a word for FRAUD

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The good ideas of Volney Mathesin's creative processing
sure sound like what Hubbard perverted to give us
scientology auditing.
http://www.lermanet.com/exit/hubbard-the-hypnotist4.htm

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recently a reader on ars newsgroup asked about the
source of OTIII...which was promoted widely in Ron's Journal 1967
as:

THE WALL OF FIRE

from the footnote at the bottom of this page:

http://www.lermanet.com/excalibur/

End Note 1 - It is apparent that the great charlatan L Ron Hubbard
wanted you to think OTIII and the NOTS, NEDS and other secret upper
levels came from Excalibur. However, the true source is from a book
also published around the turn of the last century, © 1882 by John
Ballou called "OHASPE", notable is that OHASPE was claimed to have
been written by "automatic writing" mentioned by Hubbard in Dianetics.
The concepts use to describe the condition the OT levels are supposedly
a cure for are in this book. The dense, esoteric, nomenclature does
not make for easy reading of OHASPE or of Dianetics.

On the "OT Levels" is where you get rid of infestations of body
thetans

drujas is a word used for evil spirit or hubbard's "body" "thetan"

" A knot was bound upon me: foul smelling slaves were clinched upon
me, millions of them, tens of millions; and the shafts of their curses
pierced my soul: I was as one lacerated and bound with salt" page 490
P. 21

"Oh that I could be freed from them" page 491 P.24

"2. Gessica had the vessels constructed with walls of fire around the
margins, to prevent the drujas escaping. And there were built in all
four hundred vessels. Each capable of carrying one hundred million
drujias.

"the ethereans drove the drujas into the vessels, whereupon the door
way in the wall of the ship closed. And then the workers of the ship
put it under way…

In the first year, Gessica delivered five thousand million drujias, in
the second, he delivered thirty five thousand million drujias

Page 497 P 2 - 498 P 4

The drujias were being delivered to Earth

---------------------------------------

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Last edited by lermanet_com on Fri Jan 19, 2007 8:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jan 19, 2007 4:33 pm 
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In other words, you are supplyling even more evidence to
support the idea of annoying souls?

This only makes LRH appear more brilliant. Not merely making
things up out of the blue, but recognizing real conditions
that others have noticed from time to time throughout human history.

Quote:
Chapter XXI:

4. And if a mortal have greater wisdom and strength of soul than the drujas, he ruleth over them, to a good purpose, reforming them and raising them up out of darkness and helplessness.

5. But if the drujas have greater power than the mortal, then they pull him down in darkness, making of him a man to lust after the affairs of earth. Sometimes they help man to riches and great power; and if he have sons and daughters who are brought up in idleness and ease and luxury, then the drujas fasten upon them, leading them in their own way, of lust and debauchery, or hard-heartedness.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jan 19, 2007 5:12 pm 
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Pitball,

Actually, you are the one who supplies the evidence for the idea of annoying souls.

Arnie,
Great find!

The Anabaptist Jacques


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jan 19, 2007 5:37 pm 
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Thanks Arnie,

I was going to ask you to put together a thread that puts all your plagiarism research together in one thread, but you did it without me even asking you. You must be OT!! hehe

I'm going to put a "L. Ron Hubbard was a plagiarist" link on my story, which is getting anywhere between 200 and 400 views a week.

Keep up the good work!!

mb

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jan 19, 2007 7:54 pm 
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Thank you A.J. and Mr B

But WAIT, there is still MORE!

A one time scientologist, Peter Forde, did a most detailed analysis
of why Hubbard's OTIII yarn was and is complete rubbish.

This write up has been credited with exiting many current members,
I believe Dan Garvin mentioned it specifically...

http://www.lermanet.com/exit/volcanos.html

In this weeks edition of Science published by AAAS
http://www.sciencemag.org there is a really good
refutation of incident I in the Xenu rubbish... oh wait, that's "ADVANCED TECHNOLOGY" for pitbul, have to be politcally correct you know...

Anyway, the Incident I science fiction by L Ron Hubbard..
well documented in the clearwater sun by Richard Leiby,starts out with

4 Quadrillion years ago.... and includes 'chariot comes out' and cherub 'blows horn'

4 quadrillion? million, billions, trillions, quadrillions right?

well clams, I have some bad news for you.

"This then is our universe: On the whole, it is spatially flat and 13.7 billion years old, both of which are known to 1% precision; it is expanding at a rate of 70 + - 2 km/s per megaparsec, and the expansion is speeding up' and it is composed of 24 + - 4% matter and 76 + - 4% dark energy, with 4.2 +- 0.5% of the matter in the form of atoms, between 0.1 and 1 % in form of neutrinos, and with the bulk of the matter dark.." (1)

So if the universe started 13.7 billion years ago

Where did the cherub, chariot and horn come from???
For that matter, as Hubturd calls this the MEST universe,
apparantly time is what the T stands for in MEST, so.. time
started 13.7 billion years ago...

So where did the chariot come from?

TPark? Fluffy? Pitbul? any true believers explain Hubbard's
conundrum with physical evidence?

You don't suppose Hubbard pulled it out of his *ss??

Do you?

Hypnotized scientologists believe that
everything Hubbard said was the truth...

or was it?

regards,
may the truth set you free

Arnie Lerma

(1) page 59, Volume 315, 5 Jan 2007 Science published by the AAAS
citation for that paragraph is listed as M. Tegmark et al.

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Last edited by lermanet_com on Fri Jan 19, 2007 8:07 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jan 19, 2007 7:59 pm 
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Did you get another payoff check this week? You seem rather prolific
with all these dis-information posts.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jan 19, 2007 8:11 pm 
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pitbull wrote:
Did you get another payoff check this week? You seem rather prolific
with all these dis-information posts.


Oh pitbul, may I quote you?

Pitbull "Science Magazine is Disinformation"

or did you go past a misunderstood word or phrase?
you should consult Virginia Waddy regarding
how to look up words properly, maybe you are
having trouble because you are using her source materials
as altered by a psychopath named L Ron Hubbard
http://www.lermanet.com/exit/studytech/

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jan 19, 2007 8:29 pm 
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You are truly a pro Arnie:

Mixing truth and lies. "Legitimate" sources with total frou-frou
speculation to give it the air of respectablity.

I sure wish I had the chance to work closely with LRH like you
did, but not all of us are so privelidged.

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There's an old saying: when the going gets tough - pit bulls call a Scientologist."
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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jan 20, 2007 6:47 am 
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Arnie,

Do you know anything about the "One-shot clear" fiasco?

Apparently, in the early days, Hubbard was trying to do this regarding exteriorization. Then, later, he denounced this and blamed others.

Do you know what I am refering to?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jan 20, 2007 2:54 pm 
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programmer_guy wrote:
Arnie,

Do you know anything about the "One-shot clear" fiasco?

Apparently, in the early days, Hubbard was trying to do this regarding exteriorization. Then, later, he denounced this and blamed others.

Do you know what I am refering to?



Just from reading about it
That was before my time in Scn (1968)

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Jul 03, 2007 9:46 am 
This is one helluva post, Arnie. Just catching up to what I have missed the past two years or so. Ya know, the subject of INC I is something I have some serious theories about and would like to respond to. You said:

Quote:
4 quadrillion? million, billions, trillions, quadrillions right?

So if the universe started 13.7 billion years ago

Where did the cherub, chariot and horn come from???
For that matter, as Hubturd calls this the MEST universe,
apparantly time is what the T stands for in MEST, so.. time
started 13.7 billion years ago...


My first impression is that Hubbard remote viewed the future so he could also be the Source of Topological Quantum Field Theory and Quantum String Theory <LOL>.

Seriously, when I did OTIII in late 1968, I got to the Cherub & Pilot part and I wondered the same thing but I just assumed (being physics minded) the man was talking about a near-infinite number of universes and we were just going to the original one closest to the beginning of Time itself!! Talk about self-convincing mock ups!! <bad pun> -So I thought doing "INC I" was fun and much more real to me than INC II hahahahaha.

But you really asked some good questions, which made me think of "What was I thinking, dude". It was SUPPOSED to be a standard science, Right? I dont understand why Pitbull or Fluffy or TPark (are they still around?) didnt answer? You werent baiting them. It's a real good question. Standard science means duplicatible results, asks for standard provable answers so what is the problem?

True enough, "INC I" would have to have occured 745,000 times the known age of the Current Universe. So Hubbard goes contrary to the knowledge and proofs of the greatest quantum and relative field theory physicists -- every one of them -- of this century. (pretty good for a few classes in physics at GW U -- if he ever attended at all).

But your thoughts also brought to mind a similiar, brief study I made a few years back about the "Incident I" subject matter. Without regard to the Time illogic, I instead investigated what forms of magick he was studying (or would have studied) with Jack Parsons.

Behold, I found and got somewhat familiar with a psuedo-Kabbalistic form of magick called Enochian Temples -- work done by Parsons and Crowley. Sure enough, I found references to Cherubs, Pilots, Archangels, sounds of Trumpets, visions of demons, etc etc. The whole thing is a kind of magickal excercise performed by an advanced student -- like a form of Thesis. Get this: The whole work is done on the "astral plane" -- in other words, is MOCKED UP :-) Here is a link to some of that work. http://www.hermetic.com/browe/index.html

Concluding, as far as the Quadrillions thing I believe Hubbard just made it up. But the content of "INC I" -- though never happening in reality, is composed of some seriously basic constructs of our Subconciousness -- this is what the point of the Enochian (and other forms of magic) is about -- to alter consciousness though revelation of inner "Archetypes" of our being.

BUT! Most importantly, my discovery/perception is that "INC 1" was Hubbard's personal construct -- and only his alone -- not anyone else, for God's Sake !!!! Sticking us into his personal constructs is no less one of the major unheralded sources of OT Hypnosis, I kid you not. Nothing less than sticking every *individual* being into a single mold. Voila! What do you end up with???

Some day I'd like to revisit the nascent work I started and really get into it, but it is so far from many people's reality, especially when the SCIOS still believe Hubbard was investigating Jack Parson's group as a Navy Spy
-- no wonder so many of them (was us, I never forget it) -- had no problem going into lifetime debt buying the [Brooklyn] Bridge :-O

~The Cherub~


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Jul 03, 2007 6:51 pm 
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"Wall of Fire" comes from the Bible. See http://www.rbc.org/odb/odb-10-08-03.shtml

Cherub2U, see the thread
Xemnu of the Magic Planet at
http://ocmb.xenu.net/ocmb/viewtopic.php?t=5576


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Jul 03, 2007 7:20 pm 
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Pitbull quit being dense.

LRH stole any idea he could use, but I think it would be too much credit for him to have read OHASPE. He was eaither told about the more interesting parts or someone at Marvel comics had read the book and used the idea in a storyline for one of the comics.

Atheist


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Jul 03, 2007 8:41 pm 
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Cherub,
Very interesting post - especially your ideas about accessing subconscious archetypes. This certainly fits in with my ideas about auditing.

Quote:
BUT! Most importantly, my discovery/perception is that "INC 1" was Hubbard's personal construct -- and only his alone -- not anyone else, for God's Sake !!!! Sticking us into his personal constructs is no less one of the major unheralded sources of OT Hypnosis, I kid you not. Nothing less than sticking every *individual* being into a single mold. Voila! What do you end up with???

Fascinating.
In your absence, there have been threads in which Terril & others have asserted that it isn’t necessary to experience the Incidents exactly as laid out by LRH. Of course, there are the written references in which LRH says these things MUST be experienced exactly as he describes. And former longtime Scientologists who audited at high levels (I believe Ladayla was one of these voices, though I could be mistaken) have confirmed that one is not permitted to go on up the Bridge until one has experienced these Incidents exactly as per Hubbard.

It has been said that all of Scn is just Hubbard's own case. Or that all of Scn is just an extrapolation of the mind of Hubbard. True, IMHO. By abandoning the idea that one MUST experience the Incidents exactly as LRH said, are some of the FZers breaking loose of that? And, if so, what will come next? If it's no longer a requirement to experience the Incidents exactly as per Ron, then what WILL the requirements, if any, be? Will other areas of the tech then also be altered, or interpreted in ways that conflict with LRH specifications?

I’d like to see more discussion of this - and more of your thoughts in this area, Cherub.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jul 04, 2007 6:29 pm 
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Cherub2u wrote:

But you really asked some good questions, which made me think of "What was I thinking, dude". It was SUPPOSED to be a standard science, Right? I dont understand why Pitbull or Fluffy or TPark (are they still around?) didnt answer? You werent baiting them. ~The Cherub~


I didn't see or notice whatever it was I was supposed to answer.


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