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Sponge
Joined: 10 Apr 2006
Posts: 9580
Location: U.K.
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 Posted: Sun Jun 21, 2009 7:49 am Post subject:
Scientology: The Truth Rundown **UPDATED, 13th June 2010**
Subject description: SPTimes: special report on the Church of Scientology
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Thread Index:
The latest part:
"No Kids Allowed" / Scientology & Abortions / The Headley Lawsuits
http://ocmb.xenu.net/ocmb/viewtopic.php?p=378738#378738
Part 6: Larry Anderson: "He Wants His Money Back"
http://ocmb.xenu.net/ocmb/viewtopic.php?p=372997#372997
Part 5: "OT-VIII" Scientology's "Elite"
(Interviews: Sherry Katz, Mary Jo Leavitt and Geir Isene)
http://ocmb.xenu.net/ocmb/viewtopic.php?p=371614#371614
Part 4: "Caught between Scientology and her husband, Annie Tidman chose the church"
http://ocmb.xenu.net/ocmb/viewtopic.php?p=369075#369075
Part 3 articles, 1st Nov 09, jump to these posts:
Pt.3 Chapter 1of3: "Chased by their Church" http://ocmb.xenu.net/ocmb/viewtopic.php?p=368170#368170
Pt.3 Chapter 2of3: "What Happned in Vegas" http://ocmb.xenu.net/ocmb/viewtopic.php?p=368173#368173
Pt.3 Chapter 3of3: "Man Overboard" http://ocmb.xenu.net/ocmb/viewtopic.php?p=368174#368174
Part 2: "Strength in their Numbers" http://ocmb.xenu.net/ocmb/viewtopic.php?p=364060#364060
Part 1:
The Truth Rundown:
Scientology: The Truth Rundown
Chapter 1 of 3 in a special report on the Church of Scientology
By Joe Childs and Thomas C. Tobin, Times Staff Writers
St. Petersburg Times
Posted: Jun 21, 2009
http://www.tampabay.com/news/article1012148.ece
Death in slow motion: Ch. 2 of 3 in a special report on Scientology
http://www.tampabay.com/news/article1012234.ece
Ecclesiastical justice: Ch. 3 of 3 in a special report on Scientology
http://www.tampabay.com/news/scientology/article1012575.ece
Main Index page for the special report: http://www.tampabay.com/specials/2009/reports/project/
Includes other info, bios, scientology's response, letter from Miscavige & VIDEO
Your easy-to-remember link redirect to the main article series page:
www.truthrundown.shows.it
SP Times article "Situation Room" on whyweprotest.net...
http://forums.whyweprotest.net/312-st-petersburg-times-expose/
| Quote: |
[...]
This account comes from executives who for decades were key figures in Scientology's powerful inner circle. Marty Rathbun and Mike Rinder, the highest-ranking executives to leave the church, are speaking out for the first time.
[...] |
ABOUT BLOODY TIME!
Other parallel articles running in the SP Times this week....
St. Petersburg Times notes the huge worldwide takeup of their new article series ....
Church of Scientology investigation gets worldwide response
http://www.tampabay.com/news/article1012324.ece
22 June 2009
As St. Petersburg Times' tough Scientology stories arc across media, some celebrity church members are silent
June 22, 2009
http://blogs.tampabay.com/media/2009/06/as-st-petersburg-times-scientology-stories-arc-across-media-celebrity-church-members-are-silent.html
Scientology: A smiling storefront, a darker interior
St. Petersburg Times
By Howard Troxler, Times Columnist
In Print: Tuesday, June 23, 2009
http://www.tampabay.com/news/religion/article1012458.ece
Leaving the Church of Scientology: a huge step
St. Petersburg Times
By Thomas C. Tobin and Joe Childs, Times Staff Writers
In Print: Tuesday, June 23, 2009
http://www.tampabay.com/news/scientology/article1012520.ece
A Times Editorial
The abuse behind Scientology's facade
In Print: St. Petersburg Times, Wednesday, June 24, 2009
http://www.tampabay.com/opinion/editorials/article1012832.ece
PDF of the front pages for all 3 main parts:
http://www.tampabay.com/specials/publication/Times_1A/20090621.pdf
http://www.tampabay.com/specials/publication/Times_1A/20090622.pdf
http://www.tampabay.com/specials/publication/Times_1A/20090623.pdf
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Who is David Miscavige?
Last edited by Sponge on Mon Jun 14, 2010 5:42 am; edited 42 times in total |
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moontaco
Joined: 31 May 2002
Posts: 895
Location: NYC
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Posted: Sun Jun 21, 2009 7:55 am Post subject:
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O hai! I posted that in Opinions and Debates, too, a few minutes ago. I thought people wouldn't see it down here!
I haven't even had time to read the whole thing yet. This is so exciting. |
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Wieber
Joined: 23 May 2006
Posts: 5495
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Sponge
Joined: 10 Apr 2006
Posts: 9580
Location: U.K.
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| Posted: Sun Jun 21, 2009 8:35 am Post subject:
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| Quote: | COMING TOMORROW PART 2
New details about the case of Lisa McPherson — who died in the care of Scientologists — from the executive who directed the church's handling of the case. He admits he ordered the destruction of incriminating evidence.
COMING TUESDAY PART 3
The defectors describe bizarre behavior, group punishments and other facets of the church's internal justice system. |
Main Index page for the special report: http://www.tampabay.com/specials/2009/reports/project/
Includes other info. and a VIDEO
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Who is David Miscavige?
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Wieber
Joined: 23 May 2006
Posts: 5495
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| Posted: Sun Jun 21, 2009 8:51 am Post subject:
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I am copying, pasting and saving the material of these articles for my own personal use. That way I will have them if they get pulled.
I can see many threads starting up as a result of this.
I think I'll send the link to the story into the heartland of American conservatism. They love this stuff.
_________________
Reading List: http://www.worldcat.org./profiles/Wieber/lists/563909 scientology is just another cult. "I feel we could almost fly to Europe on this." Dr. Steve Wiseman http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GXxPu40S_3c |
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Wieber
Joined: 23 May 2006
Posts: 5495
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| Posted: Sun Jun 21, 2009 9:18 am Post subject:
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There.
Emails away!
The recipients will pass them on and the people who get those will pass them on again and so on and so on.
| Quote: | | Remember the wisdom of Solomon in the book of Proverbs. "He that troubleth his own house shall inherit the wind." |
In this case I think he's inheriting the whirlwind.
_________________
Reading List: http://www.worldcat.org./profiles/Wieber/lists/563909 scientology is just another cult. "I feel we could almost fly to Europe on this." Dr. Steve Wiseman http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GXxPu40S_3c |
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Judith Anderson
Joined: 16 Mar 2006
Posts: 890
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| Posted: Sun Jun 21, 2009 2:04 pm Post subject:
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| Yes! My newspaper came through -again- like I knew it would! I just now went out to the driveway, retrieved the paper, removed the wrapper and there was DM's face staring back at me on the front page. I am beside myself! Thank you St. Pete Times. I hope you win an award for your courage and honesty. |
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PTS
Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1415
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| Posted: Sun Jun 21, 2009 2:18 pm Post subject:
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Enturbulation right in Flag's back yard.............MOST EXCELLENT!!!
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Liber Et Audax |
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Sponge
Joined: 10 Apr 2006
Posts: 9580
Location: U.K.
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| Posted: Sun Jun 21, 2009 3:56 pm Post subject:
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| Judith Anderson wrote: | | Yes! My newspaper came through -again- like I knew it would! I just now went out to the driveway, retrieved the paper, removed the wrapper and there was DM's face staring back at me on the front page. I am beside myself! Thank you St. Pete Times. I hope you win an award for your courage and honesty. |
It always seems so much more awesome to see it in print on fresh crisp newspaper. 
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Who is David Miscavige?
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Sponge
Joined: 10 Apr 2006
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Location: U.K.
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Sponge
Joined: 10 Apr 2006
Posts: 9580
Location: U.K.
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| Posted: Sun Jun 21, 2009 8:57 pm Post subject:
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Gawker weights in:
Tampa Bay Paper Throws Down Hard-Hitting Scientology Report
By Foster Kamer, Sun Jun 21 2009,
http://gawker.com/5298790/tampa-bay-paper-throws-down-hard+hitting-scientology-report
| Quote: | The St. Petersburg Times is running a massive report on Scientology, focusing on leader David Miscavige and high-ranking defectors spilling on him. Revealed: Miscavige's sadistic temper. Like when he made staffers play 'violent' musical chairs, scored to Queen's "Bohemian Rhapsody."
The three-part expose, which continues tomorrow and on Tuesday, had Times reporters out doing serious nose-to-the-grindstone reporting, gathering history, interviews, and sitting for hours with Scientology flacks and reps. They published plenty of material Scientology gave them, including a letter from Miscavige about him not being interviewed for the article, though the Times asserts that they "first requested an interview with Mr. Miscavige on May 13, and offered to meet with him in person, or interview him by telephone at any time since."
[...]
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Who is David Miscavige?
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Sponge
Joined: 10 Apr 2006
Posts: 9580
Location: U.K.
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| Posted: Sun Jun 21, 2009 9:41 pm Post subject:
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Monsters & Critics:
High level Scientology defectors expose David Miscavige and cult practices
By April MacIntyre Jun 21, 2009
http://www.monstersandcritics.com/people/news/article_1484955.php/High_level_Scientology_defectors_expose_David_Miscavige_and_cult_practices
| Quote: | Four high ranking Scientology leaders have defected from the Scientology movement and are talking to the press about the inner workings of the cash-driven L. Ron Hubbard construct, and its current leader David Miscavige.
The ex Scientology leaders have gone on record with The St. Petersburg Times; the news outlet is running a massive three-part report on Scientology focusing on leader David Miscavige that gives a chronology of when and why Hubbard chose Clearwater, Florida as his U.S. hub for the cult's operations, how people are broken down and indoctrinated into the group and how the sect legally bullied the I.R.S. into granting them tax exemption like any other religious organization.
Miscavige's reported sadistic temper is also revealed in the expose that claims he used classic cult indoctrination methods like sleep deprivation, isolation and made Scientology staffers play 'violent' musical chairs, scored to Queen's "Bohemian Rhapsody."
The whistle blower ex Scientologists tell the St. Petersburg reports that Miscavige "slapped a manager named Tom De Vocht, threw him to the ground and delivered more blows. De Vocht took the beating and the humiliation in silence — the way other executives always took the leader's attacks."
The details were shared by Marty Rathbun and Mike Rinder, who were described as "the highest-ranking executives to leave the church."
[....] |
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Sponge
Joined: 10 Apr 2006
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| Posted: Mon Jun 22, 2009 1:53 am Post subject:
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Associated Press now has it.
Expect it to go viral as of now.
Report: Violence common among Scientology managers
http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5hQalWpLPYi0hvw-OOc9ftz53zDGgD98VC5HG0
That headline is a bit weak. Some of the others carrying the AP newswire are choosing their own headlines though.
The avalanche starts...
Washington Post is carrying the above AP newsfeed
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/06/21/AR2009062101794.html
..and Forbes...
http://www.forbes.com/feeds/ap/2009/06/21/ap6568785.html
...and The Houston Chronicle
Report cites violence in Scientology
Paper: Staff members hit without warning dozens of times
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/nation/6490963.html
The Chicago Sun Times
Scientology leader Miscavige leads with violence: report
http://www.suntimes.com/news/nation/1633066,w-scientology-miscavige-physical-violence-062109.article
.and the UK now has it...
in The Guardian...
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/feedarticle/8569836
and the Daily Mail...
Scientology leader close to Tom Cruise accused of hitting senior members of church
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/article-1194652/Scientology-leader-close-Tom-Cruise-accused-hitting-senior-members-church.html?ITO=1490
MSNBC.....
Report: Scientology leaders often violent
Leader struck employees, ordered other execs to attack as well, paper says
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/31478638/ns/us_news-faith/
ABC Action News...
http://www.abcactionnews.com/news/local/story/Report-Violence-common-among-Scientology-managers/cDMLgEdEyE2cOEkakpSI7A.cspx?rss=794
FOX News....
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,528051,00.html
LA Times....
Scientology leadership rife with physical violence, report says
http://www.latimes.com/features/religion/la-na-scientology22-2009jun22,0,2574477.story?track=rss
and presumably there'll be many many many more of the press taking the AP newswire report through the night and into tomorrow. It's already starting to go global and I can't keep up .
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Who is David Miscavige?
Last edited by Sponge on Mon Jun 22, 2009 12:56 pm; edited 17 times in total |
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Sponge
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| Posted: Mon Jun 22, 2009 1:58 am Post subject:
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Anonymous has provided a transcript of the Tommy Davis audio response:
Original audio:
http://www.tampabay.com/specials/2009/reports/project/church-response.shtml
| Quote: | Quote:
Part 1 – “A disciplined religious order”
It’s just getting more and more bizarre as we go along. And so I it sort of moves into the outer realms of reality that I can’t even conceive of. But I think we need to go back to the fundamental basic here which is that the Sea Organization’s a religious order it’s a disciplined religious order it has its you know, to use a non-Scientological term, its penances, it has its rewards, it has its penalties as such something in the operation of and the, you know, obedience and compliance that one has as a Sea Org member is absolute.
That is what we’re here for and that is why. It is based on our agreement with policy and all the things that are done are based on policy.
Some of it is Sea Org policy that is privy only to Sea Org members - as to the reasons why and the motivations for.
But I think we need to boil it down to something more fundamental here which is that not only all Sea Org members but all Scientologists expect that Sea Org members are a crew of tough sonsofbitches which we are.
We will go further, farther, longer, harder than anybody else. That’s why we’re in the Sea Org. And people who can’t cut it they get out.
People who can’t cut it no matter how tough he tried to make it seem he was are people like Marty Rathbun. People like Amy Scobee and people like Tom De Vocht. But the bottom line common denominator of Sea Org members who leave and then choose to be critical is that they were real criminal, out-of-control sonsofbitches when they were in.
Which is what these bastards were. Because there are people with the Sea Org and they carry on as Scientologists and they go back to being public Scientologists and they’re just happy as clams in doing so.
But the common denominator of these guys is that they were up to some real bad bad bad bad bad stuff and unfortunately, as Monique alluded to early on in our conversation, there were things that some of them, particularly with relationship to Mike and Marty, are things that we can’t talk about.
And the thing that’s so sick about this is that Marty knows we can’t talk about them and he knows we won’t. But they get they cut right to the core of exactly why he was unceremoniously removed. ‘Cause let me tell you I dealt with that guy and when you talk to him again?
You tell him Tommy Davis said he is an outright coward. And that he made him out made himself out like a tough guy and he’s a bastard and a coward.
And he’s a psychotic. Psychotic. That he would do this to his friends, the people that he worked with - Joe, look at me when I’m talking to you – the people that he worked with.
Like us. His friends. Who trusted him? Who thought that he had our backs? In the clutches? When people were trying to destroy us, and he does this? He has no credibility. He’s a bad man and he’s psychotic. And you make sure that you tell him that I said he’s psychotic. ‘Cause he is. Only a psychotic would do what he’s doing.
Quote:
Part 2 – Miscavige can’t be everywhere at once
Here’s the point I think it really boils down to too - it’s sort of an attempt again to paint Mr Miscavige in a certain light. And it makes it seem I – the recurring thing that I’m getting here with of all this is Dave did this and Dave did that and Dave did this and it’s as if there isn’t another single blessed person in all of Scientology, the Sea Org or Int Management.
And that’s what’s really disingenuous here is that Marty, Mike, Amy, and Tom had peers. Those peers had opinions(?), positions, ranks, seniority, junior, higher, lower, all over the place, covering the map.
They all had jobs and these kinds of things. And it sort of seems like a picture is being painted here like David Miscavige is this madman who roams around the base, throws people in swimming pools, locks them in trailers, beats them unmercifully, and that’s sort of the Scientology upper level.
But then how does that account for, well, here we are in 2009 and there’s 80 buildings forming 89,000 sq ft of renovations, 3 orgs that opened up just in the last couple of weeks, a 280,000 sq ft renovated Fort Harrison, a 173,000 sq ft renovated Old Cove, and you know one of the largest architectural design firms with 270 with 73 dedicated staff just to church projects and another 273 architects or 50,000,000 lectures and 9,000,000 books all produced in house in the largest in-house digital printing plant in the world or the large, non-governmental anti-drug program or the largest anti-rights uh uh uhuhuh human rights education program or the 150,000 volunteer ministers and and and and and and and and and.
So, if David Miscavige is a nut who’s running around beating everybody then [garbled] bend (?) time, because clearly in between beating people, he’s doing all the things I just described. And that’s where this story doesn’t add up.
Quote:
Part 3 – Sea Org members say Miscavige has never struck them
As far as the rest of these allegations they’re absolutely total lies. They’re total utter complete lies. And I think I think it bears covering at this point now a couple things about this.
You know certainly the likes of reading(?) it off Mark, Mark Yager, Norman Starkey, Guillaume Lesevre all these people who are current members of the Sea Organization I’ve spoken with all of them.
They will they absolutely say that they have never ever ever been physically struck, attacked, anything you know, physically contacted as you tend to put it aggressively gone after in a physical, way, shape or form by Mr Miscavige. Ever. Period. Absolutely not. Never happened. Didn’t occur.
Quote:
Part 4 – “You just have to change the names”
Guillaume Lesevre, Mark Yager, Mark Ingber, Ray Mithoff, Norman Starkey, Wendell Reynolds, and Mike Rinder. By report, and with witnesses on every single occasion, all of them were either slapped, punched, kicked, choked, grabbed by the neck, thrown to the floor or tackled into furniture by none other than Marty Rathbun. Every single one of them.
Okay, so you just have to change the names. Okay slapped, punched, kicked, choked, grabbed by the neck, thrown to the floor, tackled into furniture. Guillaume punched and tackled into furniture. Mark Yager punched.
Mark Ingber tackled into furniture. Ray Mithoff punched. Norman Starkey slapped multiple times, punched multiple times, kicked multiple times, thrown onto the floor multiple times, and tackled into furniture multiple times.
Wendell Reynolds tackled into furniture. And the one person who was attacked more than any of them and more viciously than any of them by Marty Rathbun and more frequently over a longer period of time than by any of them was Mike Rinder – who was slapped, punched, kicked, choked, grabbed by the neck, thrown to the floor, and tackled into furniture.
The primary incident of which, which was witnessed by Guillaume, Mark – both Marks – Ray, not by, no Norman didn’t, Norm wasn’t there - Wendell Reynolds, and a number of others and it is the most famous incident and it is an incident that occurred in January of 2004, in the room that you guys keep describing that these meetings occur, in the CMO Int building or you guys call it the double-wide trailers – was an incident where inexplicably, out of nowhere, no forewarning, Marty Rathbun leapt onto Mike Rinder, tackled him to the ground, straddled him at the chest, grabbed him at the throat, choked him while banging his head into the floor, screaming at him asking him a question repeatedly, to the point that he was turning purple, and requiring him to be peeled off of Mike by 5 grown men, none of whom are shorter than 6ft tall – some of whom are as much as 6ft 4” – at which point they pried Marty off of Mike, Mike went outside.
And then another gentleman, who also very much would like to talk to you, then, just shortly thereafter, saw Marty go walking by muttering something about Mike, thought it was kind of strange, followed Marty outside, at which point Marty then found Mike again, threw Mike to the ground, punched him repeatedly.
This individual pulled Marty off of Mike. Mike stood up and told Marty to stop. Marty was winding up to punch Mike again in the kidneys this time and this individual threw his arms around Marty because he thought - or around Mike because he thought Marty was going to punch him in the kidneys, judging by the wind up, was worried about it.
He happened to be wearing a titanium watch and Marty’s blow connected with his watch because his arms were wrapped around Mike and the blow snapped the watchstrap in half. At which point, he pulled Mike away who was bleeding from his ear and had contusions around his head and took him off to get him medical attention. And that was the last time Marty Rathbun saw Mike Rinder in Sea Org.
Quote:
Part 5 – There were witnesses to it
Talking about 50 instances of violence on 22 people – only reason I’m using those numbers is this that those are all where the person themselves can state that it occurred and there were witnesses to it. Multiple witnesses.
Okay, and that is why I bring it up. The point is is this is that if you want to get into why and how and so on and so forth, sure we can get into the time track and we can get into all of this.
I’m saying, here’s the thing, if you came to me and said we were talking to Marty Rathbun and he’s left the church and he’s talking about some of his disagreements and so on and so forth and you never brought up anything about physical violence and never said anything about David Miscavige beating this person that person or whatever, I wouldn’t bring it up.
I wouldn’t. Even though I knew it would annihilate his credibility I wouldn’t do it. I wouldn’t do it. But he’s the one who’s saying that David Miscavige beat these people and he’s saying that David Miscavige beat the EXACT SAME PEOPLE THAT HE BEAT.
And THAT’S what pisses me off. Because this guy’s a FUCKING LUNATIC. And I don’t have to explain how or why he became one or how it was allowable. The fact is that he’s saying David Miscavige did what HE did.
Not once, not twice, but 50 times to 22 people where the people are still around and they can attest to it and there are witnesses to it. And the instances that you’re saying that Mr Miscavige engaged in aren’t that way. And you’re saying 75 to 100 but it isn’t true.
And now I’m getting a little angry, am I angry at you? Not necessarily, but I’m goddamned pissed at Marty Rathbun. Because he knows that he was the reign of terror, the whole track prison warden, and the lunatic because he admitted it to it, he admitted to it.
And he knew and it was part of his downfall. And I think that the individuals that were attacked by him have the right to talk to you about it. And I think that the individuals that’s he’s saying Mr Miscavige attacked have a right to it.
Because factually every single person on that list that you sent me, that fax of, I have affidavits from them stating that they were never beat by Mr Miscavige.
So that’s the problem with this thing and when I came to you and I said that we had things that we wanted fact-checked, that there were a few things that you were saying that Marty was going to fact-check, that there was going to be fact-checked, these are the things that I’m talking about.
Okay, because they bear fact-checking. Because bottom line the problem is is we can drop down into this minutia but we’re talking about the ecclesiastical leader of the Scientology religion.
Okay? And it’s a bigger picture than that here. And from Marty Rathbun, Amy Scobee, or Tom De Vocht to leave and tell their tales of woe and fall into the category exactly like so many have before – Jesse Prince, Vicki Aznaran, Larry Wollersheim, Robert Vaughn Young, Stacy Young – all of them the same allegations, saying the same things, in some cases things far more horrible. And every time Mr Miscavige has been vindicated as has the church. And the thing is, is they have become what they detested. And they have become what they fought for so long. And that is the truth of it.
Quote:
Part 6 – The Lisa McPherson case
Looking into her folder, writing clear R factors, that kind of thing, absolutely false memory, never happened. He never did. Total lie. Never did. Never did. Never wrote anything including – he can’t remember the last time he wrote something in somebody’s folder. I’m sure he couldn’t remember the last time he wrote something in somebody’s folder. He was an auditor. It was his first post in the Sea Org. He was a CS’er. [garbled].
Interviewer: Did he know of Lisa McPherson? Do you know?
Oh I didn’t know I didn’t ask him. That’s one thing I do know, like I didn’t take these allegations and go and talk to Dave about them. I’m just not going to do that. |
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Who is David Miscavige?
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Sponge
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