To Photoshop gurus...

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povmec
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To Photoshop gurus...

Post by povmec » Thu Jan 03, 2008 7:14 pm

Here are two pictures of Mathison/Hubbard demonstrating the e-meter:

http://www.lisamcpherson.org/images/lrh_lying_woman.jpg

http://www.lisamcpherson.org/images/mathison.jpg

I don't know if this has been done, but I have wished for some time now that someone could pin these two pictures on top of each other to create the best match possible. To be sure no details are lost, if a rescale is needed for one of the picture, it should be upward. I think a slight rotation might be needed too.

The origin of both matching images should be top-left corner, so that it becomes possible to create a web page where hovering the mouse over/off one version of the picture allows switching between the two versions (blank area should be used to fill missing part of one picture relative to the other).

I always thought it was the best way to compare both pictures (as opposed to side by side), but I don't have the software to do this, but it's clear that some posters here are expert at using Photoshop (thanks for the laughs :) btw)

Any taker?

Ray.

[edited to fix typos]
Last edited by povmec on Thu Jan 03, 2008 10:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Roan
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Post by Roan » Thu Jan 03, 2008 8:56 pm

Great idea.


AND... there was at least one very good, very long, very involved (and often contentious) thread about this last year.

If you havn't seen it, it would be worth looking up.
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Post by Don Carlo » Thu Jan 03, 2008 9:44 pm

The thread was "The Profit" and the Mathison discussion was on

bottom of page 11
viewtopic.php?t=4571&start=150
and
most of page 12
viewtopic.php?t=4571&start=165

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hartley
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Post by hartley » Thu Jan 03, 2008 10:30 pm

You could do it using Paint, Photoshop not required!

First you need to crop both images so they cover the same area - they are both taken from a larger original. Then you have to resize one to be the same as the other, the dimensions aren't quite the same.

The coding in HTML could be as below - your WIDTH and HEIGHT and filenames may differ. Note that the single and double inverted commas have to be as shown.

<A onmouseover="image2.src='mathison01.jpg';" onmouseout="image2.src='lrh_lying_woman01.jpg';"><img name="image2" src="lrh_lying_woman01.jpg" WIDTH=682 HEIGHT=582 border=0></a>

You're correct, the orientation isn't quite the same either.

[edited out comments, I got the two muddled up]
Last edited by hartley on Fri Jan 04, 2008 8:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by povmec » Thu Jan 03, 2008 11:15 pm

I actually tried a while ago using a GIF software I downloaded, in trial mode. Although the result was interesting, it wasn't perfect (the slight rotation was the problem). I threw the result during a cleaning spree...

It doesn't matter that much to me who faked who (some say both are faked), it's just pure curiosity, and it might be nice to let web surfers see for themselves by webbing this.

Ray.

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caroline
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Post by caroline » Fri Jan 04, 2008 5:48 am

Okay, here's a try. Mathison photo colorized,rotated and enlarged by about 121.5%, opacity 50%.

Image

I used the woman's body, the e-meter and the microphone stands as points of reference.

It would be good if we could get a better version of the Mathison image, as there are distortions, but with what we have, I'd say, Hubbard was "photoshopped in" or equivalent. Mathison's body position is far more plausible than Hubbard's.

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Post by Peter Schilte » Fri Jan 04, 2008 7:52 am

I quickly switched between the two photos and concentrated on the audience: The audience is exactly the same. Same people in the same place, no changes in pose, no change in expression of the faces or bodies.
Hubbard was clearly cut and pasted at the position of Mathison.
"THE ONLY WAY YOU CAN CONTROL PEOPLE IS TO LIE TO THEM."
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Post by Wieber » Fri Jan 04, 2008 9:34 am

It's a little bit subjective but follow the sight lines.

Matheson appears to be looking at the woman's face. Hubbard appears to be looking about two feet beyond the top of her head. (I don't think he's looking at her 'thetan.')

(The other thing that I get from these photos is that Hubbard sure looks a lot like Robert Young in that photo. That may be a coincidence but I wouldn't put it past Hubbard to affect that look. Robert Young starred in Father Knows Best, an immensely popular television show around the time that photograph was taken (1954 - 1960). If the photos were taken earlier than 1954 the affectation may still hold. Robert Young had a very successful career in film and television before that show and was very popular.)
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Image

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Stayed up late...

Post by vongole » Fri Jan 04, 2008 10:33 am

Well, guys and gals, I stayed up late to do this for you. Here are the two photos joined together:


Image

There is no doubt at all that one of these photos is doctored. The background is exactly the same. The quality of the reproduction of the Mathison photo is poor, but not so bad that one can't see by comparison that a fraud has been perpetrated.

I ask if there is any record of the Church of Scientology presenting a false picture of L. Ron Hubbard? Has the cult ever doctored photographs to present a more positive spin on things? Does the Church of Scientology make a practice of re-writing history?

I only ask. You can decide for yourselves which was the original picture: Volney Mathison using his electropsychometer in a demonstration, or L.Ron Hubbard who later usurped Mathison's invention.

I quote Lafatty's flesh and blood. L.Ron Hubbard Jr:
"My father obtained the rights to the E-meter in 1952 from Volney Mathison in the same manner that he does everything - through fraud and coercion."
Last edited by vongole on Fri Jan 04, 2008 4:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"Dad had an insatiable desire for an awful lot of money... All the money went to Dad." L. Ron Hubbard jr.
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Post by moontaco » Fri Jan 04, 2008 2:06 pm

=D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D>

Kilia
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Post by Kilia » Fri Jan 04, 2008 2:08 pm

Well done, vongole. WELL DONE!! :)

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Post by povmec » Fri Jan 04, 2008 3:20 pm

Wow great job! Thanks very much.

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Post by WolfyRik » Fri Jan 04, 2008 4:04 pm

Nicely done! Yet another doctored photo caught out.

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Peter Schilte
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Post by Peter Schilte » Fri Jan 04, 2008 4:34 pm

Fantastic! Wonderful job, vongole! :thumleft:
"THE ONLY WAY YOU CAN CONTROL PEOPLE IS TO LIE TO THEM."
- L. Ron Hubbard

http://www.scamofscientology.nl

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vongole
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Con exposed

Post by vongole » Fri Jan 04, 2008 4:50 pm

Thanks guys!

Here is some more:


That early picture of L. Ron Hubbard "auditing" the girl on the couch is widely used by the "Church" of Scientology: Ron Mags, framed photos in Orgs etc. Not content with ripping off Mathison's invention and stealing his ideas (Mathison basically invented auditing), Lafatty may actually have decided to overwrite Mathison's image with his own! What a con! Unbelievable! It never ends!

Before Lafatty coerced Mathison into giving him ownership of the patent, he was forced to discontinue use of the e-meter for four years. Lafatty managed to justify this:
“ As we long ago suspected, the intervention of a mechanical gadget between the auditor and the preclear had a tendency to depersonalize the session. "
As soon as the old fraud managed to get his fat hands on the patent (using goodness knows what pressure on Mathison) he ate his words and reintroduced its use.

I've no idea when the Mathison/Hubbard photo was doctored - but it is a total deception. Mathison would have no reason to do so particularly since he was the one who got ripped off.

Here is the bulk of the Wikipedia article on Mathison and his invention:
Volney G. Mathison was an American experimenter/hobbyist in early biofeedback, galvanic skin response technology, and psychogalvanometer (lie-detector machine) research in the 1940s and 1950s. He was also a chiropractor and an author of paranormal and science fiction books.

Mathison discovered through experiments with early lie-detectors during the 1940s that when the subject was reminded of certain past events, the lie detector needle would fluctuate. He further determined that the degree of fluctuation was in direct proportion to the strength of the subject's reaction.

It was Mathison's idea, by way of his study of Carl Jung's theories, to create a special lie-detector for examining unconscious and subconscious reactions rather than conscious ones. This notion, however pseudoscientific, was directly appropriated by fellow science fiction author L. Ron Hubbard, who enlisted Mathison to build similar devices for use in his still-developing concepts of Dianetics and Scientology. The devices were called Mathison E-meters, short for "electro-psychometer" or sometimes "electroencephaloneuromentimograph".

Mathison and Hubbard's business relationship ended in the mid-1950s, when Hubbard, who already had coerced Mathison into giving him exclusive rights to the device, now urged Mathison to transfer complete ownership of the patent. He refused. Hubbard discontinued use of the E-meter and issued a statement that read in part:
“ As we long ago suspected, the intervention of a mechanical gadget between the auditor and the preclear had a tendency to depersonalize the session. "
Four years later, in 1958, the E-Meter returned, but it was now called the Hubbard E-Meter, with only slight modifications to the design having been made by Don Breeding and Joe Wallis. [6] E-meters once again became an essential part of Scientology's Auditing process, and no further mention was made of the four-year period in which Hubbard had disavowed it.

It has been noted by historians and critics that Mathison's concept of "Personalized Recording Methodology", which he believed would render psychology and psychiatry unnecessary, also seems to have been a considerable influence on Hubbard's own philosophy.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volney_Mathison

Here are some relevant quotes from L.Ron Hubbard Jr.'s court affadavit:
7) My father obtained the rights to the E-meter in 1952 from Volney Mathison in the same manner that he does everything - through fraud and coercion. My father learned about the E-meter from Mathison who developed it and my father fraudulently extracted those rights from Mathison so that my father could use it in Scientology auditing.

8) My father has always used the confidential information extracted from people during auditing sessions to intimidate, threaten and coerce them to do what he wanted, which often meant getting them to give him money. My father routinely used false threats and auditing information particularly about crimes people had committed to extort money from them.

9) My father has always held out Scientology and auditing to be based purely on science and not on religious "belief or faith. We regularly promised and distributed publications with "scientific guarantees". This was and has always been common practice. My father and I created a "re- ligious front" only for tax purposes and legal protection 'from fraud Claims'. We almost always told nearly everyone that Scientology was really science, not a religion, but that the religious front was created to deal--with the government.

http://www.lermanet.com/cos/rondewolf.htm
The only science that L, Ron Hubbard was qualified to write about was the science of fraud.
Last edited by vongole on Fri Jan 04, 2008 6:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"Dad had an insatiable desire for an awful lot of money... All the money went to Dad." L. Ron Hubbard jr.
[img]http://i241.photobucket.com/albums/ff198/vongoloid/new-v-4-vongole-2a-1.gif[/img] Tommy exposed: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6zIihiJIDvg

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